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I respect what you're saying, but we keep coming back to thought observing itself. I maintain that it's impossible for thought to observe itself "objectively" because of its conditioning. You agree that you are inescapably conditioned, therefore your thought is irrefutably contaminated - to what degree differs from individual to individual, but contaminated it is. All experiences are further contaminated as soon as they enter the domain of thought, as a contaminated mind can only bend and distort the truth and your contaminated accumulated experiences can only contaminate new experiences the minute they are experienced. What you perhaps need to see is, you ARE that conditioning - it's your very essence, and the ability to divorce yourself from your condition using a conditioned mind is the illusory factor in all this. |
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i dont refer to thought observing thought, i refer to the mind observing thought. even as you sit there, im sure you are conscious of present thoughts. i would argue that that consciousness is a function of the mind, not a function of thought. we experience another really good example of the stream of consciousness when we dream. the contents of our dreams represent thought. it is the mind that experiences those thoughts. we can be without thoughts, but we cant be without the mind. |
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so i would have to disagree one again. 'i' am not the conditions; 'i' am the mind that is subject to conditions. |
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The mind cannot observe thought, it is only a container for thought. Thought is your only true means of evaluating any sort of perception. I'm not sure why you are separating mind from thought as if the mind has separate thought processes to thought itself. You mind cannot experience anything - that's like saying your leg experiences something, it is thought that interprets and creates experiences. Of course as long as the mind is functioning, so can thoughts. So when you dream the mind is active and the thoughts are expressing themselves in a jumbled way, the content and purpose is not fully scientifically understood. You mention the "i". The "i" is the ego, a pure manifestation of thought, nothing to do with mind whatsoever. |
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drunken mastah could have a fucking field day here |
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haha you guys are chasing your tails, Barcode i think what Sun Ra meant by the use of the word Creative, was him trying to say the unknown factors in this world that we really do not have the capacity to understand. It was just an interesting thought, not concrete philosophy. |
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i think Sun RA was just being wordy for saying he wants to challenge the norms |
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Oh pack it in you tarts, I settled all this hours ago. I have also completed 2 rubix cubes |
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We're all chasing our tails aren't we? That seems to be what it's all about :) |
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By the way, again apologies to anyone i was rude to. I was a bit stoned last night and not sure what I was on about. I have been reading most of this throughout the day and found it quite interesting. |
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But you were the coolest one Glasse...until halo |
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tl:dr |
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no I was quite a dick. however i did kick a lot of ass on halo. |
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THEÂ STATEÂ OFÂ XLTRONIC |
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indeed. the fucking state of it. |
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sorry its all my fault. |
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you have shamed the cools |
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iirc in the last xlt cull you were high on the agenda :) |
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its kinda tl; dr for me too. im kind of tired but ill reply since its my thread. no philosophy for me though. |
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sorry for my ignorance but what is tl dr? |
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too long didn't read. the internet is pretty fast. |
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basically buddhists are fine cos they don't give a fuck - who can blame em |
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i guess well have to agree to disagree :) although im speaking from experience, thats not to say that my experiences are going to apply to you. |
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true, and it's also true that one who experiences through a distorted lens cannot imagine that the lens is distorted or see that the experience has become distorted. perhaps your lens is clean, but for me this seems doubtful or to put it more bluntly, completely unachievable. |
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