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 (nobody)...and 142 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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I think, for people who dwell in America who have evolved past Rabid (mostly R-Wing) Christianity, mindless obeyance and patriotism, and unquestioning arrogance, it must be a really terrible place to live. Life in America must really suck :( So I'm reaching out a limb of solidarity for them, knowing they have people in the Wider World (it DOES exist, would you believe it!) who support them and hope they don't get too depressed. |
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The task, for the people, who remain in America, evolved/moved after the Christianity rabic (one more a greater part the time d'R-Wing), l'obeyance, of that and Patriotismus and arrogance unquestioning, is betaeubt that a really terrible place with the life is obligation. The life in America must really aspire: _ (therefore I'm, that one excludes member of solidarity from d'un for him, knows marks that above stop stopping, popular in the world of the extension (it is constituted, the winch of him creates) that supports and the constreñimiento of the hope qu'ils don't on also attributed. |
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I'm afraid the human race is in fact a zombie human hybrid race not only americans |
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that's just a dream! silly human! |
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Hallelujah Brother!!!!! |
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No, that's just the American Dream. It's not yet a Reality, however many developing countries the US Govt. and US Business is stomping to dust, and however many Eastern Cities are turning into replicas of Houston and LA. |
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You are talking about a specific type of zombie. There are many types and come in many colour variations: Right wing christian zombie, executive type business suit zombie, muslim, reformist hippie type etc etc |
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the WASP zombie is the best known of the zombies available. These shy creatures tend to live in clonies referred to as "suburbs," where they build defensive structures such as fences (often white, and picket-ish) around their "personal area" (otherwise known as "lawn.") Favourite activities include mowing of the "personal area," baking and discriminating. |
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You are Presumptious Zombie, I see. I take it you've travelled extensively worldwide, and have breathed in the full atmosphere, culture, and history of all the lands? Or are you basing your knowledge on what you saw on TV / the Internet / Newspaper / Magazine? |
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Define extensively |
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Well I have been taught arab history and I have a mind of my own. Isn't it very presumptuous of you to think that I don't? |
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you have a mind of your own, you say? *motions for the men in white coats to come closer* |
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I didn't presume, I asked a question. Who taught you this Arab History, and what sources were used? |
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I was taught at school for about 6 years in parallel to my doomed nations history. You see I live in greece and we are very close to the whole muslim culture. Also the father of a close friend is an academic historian. We've spent countless hours discussing about issues such as that. And I can say that he is totally unbiased. I am not saying that muslims are raving lunatics but a creed is a creed any way you look at it. Oh and about the supposed question you asked... I must say that I try to respect the people I am having a discussion with. I don't think you are trying to respect me. |
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You failed to mention the sources of information, and how far-ranged was your Moslem education? Also, what about non-moslem cultures - how much do you know about them, and from where did you acquire your knowledge? |
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I don't know the details if that's what you are trying to find out. The books I got tutored from were school books. Why does it matter? |
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I wonder: what is marlowe trying to get at here? what is the point of these inquries? |
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The fact that history is a complex fabric, and that if you read a book by Mr X, he may completely fail to understand some important point, he may never have VISITED the countries he's discussing ... all kinds of factors. A book doesn't make the history true. |
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I live in du bai. i do live in a muslim culture. Does this make me any cooler?? pleaseeeeeeseeeeeeeeee! |
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People who have nothing to do with a certain situation, who are completely unbiased can see things in many layers. It is completely arbitrary when one says that having not lived a situation you aren't able to understand it. On the contrary having lived a situation, having known the people, their suffering etc you might get biased. History like it or not is clinical. History is also extremely complex, every fact in the world is connected. It is impossible to study every culture in every detail. I prefer to study patterns. To see general tendencies. I prefer to see things philosophically-from a distance. I am trying to watch and to understand biological and cultural evolution. |
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(hehe.. now you're talking my language again) it's impossible for you to step outside your own era, though.. the only person fit for researching the time we live in now, is a historian in the future.. one that lives after this time. While you live in the present-day "history," you can't see it from a distance. whether you like it or not, you ARE already biased.. ever since you were born into this time-period, you were biased, and unfit to judge it as a whole (if you want judging to be unbiased). You can see your own time, only through the "glass" over your eyes. |
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It is painful... I am almost an empty shell, my whole life is going through a lens...every thing I do or think. Yes when someone is a part of a system one is de facto not an observer no matter how hard one tries. |
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EXACTLY! you can look at the past objectively, though. the time BEFORE WW1 should be ok. |
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There are aspects of the human psyche that every human takes for granted and doesn't even know they exist. They were present back then and they are present now. We have to become something else to understand ourselves and our history. I doubt that we have the amount of time for that. |
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of course, everything in the past affects us now, but the thing is that all secrets about the past that long ago are bound to have been revealed by now, so we are able to see the reasons for what happened. |
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Well things seem to form a pattern. Moving of things to the centre-centralisation of everything. Trying to learn things and understand them is probably just a natural way that leads to cultural evolution(=change not always for the better of each individual). It just happens. It is a natural tendency. It is really funny that we don't know why we want to know stuff about the universe and all. |
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The only present pattern I see is one leading to the downfall of a certain nation. It tries to extend itself too far, and any empire based on that will surely crumble as dust. |
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In my opinion that one nation you mention is merely a vessel of a certain sociopolitical tendency. I believe we europeans (if I can call my self a european) are vessels of it too. The one nation you are talking about is just its bodyguard. |
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Ok you don't mention it |
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yes, it is a tendency, but it can be stopped. A nation doesn't HAVE to evolve into it... if control is bestowed upon the right people, the world may live to see another day. |
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I will say what the anarchists say: people in charge WILL take advantage of their positions.... I don't think human societies are possible without leaders-bosses etc though(this is an enormous issue). Maybe if we develop telepathy and confer directly alltogether or develop hive-like societies. But then we will be something different than humans |
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yeah, we need leaders.. we just need some that are able to stay right in the head when they get power. |
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I think that this is an impossible task. Maybe I am just a pessimist. It is a huge issue as well anyway. If we start now we may finish in about uhm one bazillion years. |
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If we start=if we start discussing it |
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it probably IS impossible. Politics = corruption no matter how you look at it. Any person involved in politics will become corrupted INTO their own party. You'll never be able to convince them their party is wrong. |
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As a greek singer-comedian sings: "The end is near so....lets fuck" |
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everyone should fuck! (I call Lucy Liu! she's mine!) |
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You can keep her "El o El" |
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(what DOES that mean, anyway?) |
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I don't know what happened to this thread. But thanks Fred. |
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Sorry Mastah, I disagree with both points about the past. There are things from the past that were never revealed and never will be revealed: those events that were not documented, or were documented only by the victors. And secondly, even if the past were fully laid out before us in its entirety, we would still be viewing it subjectively vis a vis our own experiences and so forth. History's logic is inductive, not deductive- no irrefutable conclusions, even if all the 'facts' are known. It's just too complicated. I agree with Puppy, patterns are more interesting and useful than particulars. Science is our way of compressing this complexity into something we can express, model and draw conclusions from. |
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I think JAroen manipulated the horrible acronym LOL into "El o El" during the "Promo bullying" days. |
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Perhaps the qualities and personality traits required to attain power in the first place - an ability to dominate one's own will over that of others, a strangle and ineffable quality we call 'charisma' - select for leaders who will inevitably exploit their positions. |
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Yes but we were discussing the common good!!! |
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this IS science. The theory I presented is the one most commonly used in humanistic-science (i study philosophy, which is one of these). the history-books are surely enough written by the victors, but historians NEVER rely solely on books... NOTHING is considered even CLOSE to being A THEORY about what happened in the past before 5-6 different, independent sources confirm it. The thing is that historians only look at particulars to try to piece together an image as a whole about what happened... what controls the actions of humans isn't small things.. it's the entirety put together. |
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"what controls the actions of humans isn't small things.. it's the entirety put together. " No doubt. The science is in attributing relative significance to the factors making up the whole, which can't be done in retrospect by the historian, even with a veritable library of sources. The image of the whole can be pieced together in any number of ways, and often each different way of viewing the outcome is equally valid, and can't be tested. So it's not science, but it is illuminating. Evolutionary psychology is my thing and I don't consider that a science either, for precisely the same reason. But I guess we're both humanistic scientists (I did some proper psychology too!) |
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History is written by the winners. How do we know that Captain Oates went out for this legendary walk? From the only surviving document: Scott's diary. And he's hardly likely to have written down, "February the 1st, bludgeoned Oates to death while he slept, then scoffed him along with the last packet of instant mash." How's that going to look when he gets rescued, eh? No, much better to say, "Oates made the supreme sacrifice," while you're dabbing up his gravy with the last piece of crusty bread. |
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Mathematics they cover everything |
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We're all alone, with no kind of atmosphere... |
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ooh! Psychology! I considered that for a while, but there were too many schematics.. anyway.. philosophy has always been.. eh.. "in my heart." "So it's not science" well.. it's just about as proveable as any other science.. even though most people think of science as a sure thing (They've been told that by society), what is normally considered science (physics, biology, practical mathematics and such) is just as uncertain as history or philosophy... the only "science" that is 100% sure (if no-one miscalculates) is regular theoretical mathematics.. the problem with theoretical math is that it can't be applied to ANYTHING at all. It is correct, but only within its own boundries / rules. |
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