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i am heavily considering purchasing this DAW for making more music... i would like to here fellow xltronic'ers comments and arguments as to what ableton live (any version) is capable of. love, mr. quoth |
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It's the only host worth buying. Looks good, sounds good, runs stable, plays nicely with the plugins I use. Most importantly with Ableton, it's totally inspiring to work in scene mode as opposed to master timeline mode which is what you're stuck in with every other host. It is the polar opposite of Cubase which is a pleasure annihilation device. |
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It's bloody amazing. BUT, I wouldn't spend £250 on it. I have a crack of it if anyone's interested. |
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you're a fucking cheapskate |
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fleetmouse, this "scene" mode... does this mean like for instance if you're fucking with a sample in real time, you can just keep on layering things on... bit by bit as oppossed to dropping them into a visual display like for instance on fruity loops? fl's you have to click on the sequencer's pads in order to get the sound when it's playing back.... am i understanding this correctly? i'll just fucking look it up myself if i'm wrong... but alll of these features jam packed into a program... current owners must have A LOT of owner manual reading to do before they get into it... to get the most out of the program... or is it too fucking easy to do everything you want it to? love, mr. quoth |
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It seemed a bit tricky to get into, but I found making a great way of getting into it. It's not done in scene mode, but from what I could see, scene is more like a jam-out type of thing. Powerful and fun. |
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Programs like ableton live are just as likely to act as a crutch as they are to benefit you. |
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Cubase, altho a bit clunkier than ableton gives you the ability to write full songs with less of a reliance upon loops. It also gives you the ability to route your audio and midi settings with as much flexibility as possible. It just takes forever to figure out. |
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cubase is fucking expensive... and i've already got something that can control all of my midi equipment... i'm running MOTU digital performer w/unisyn, mx4, and mach five ableton live seems like a step up from mx4 (basic vst) and the mach five... (software sampler) |
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The thing with ableton is, let's say you have four or five instruments and ten sequences for each. You can swap the sequences in and out in real-time with the punch-in point quantized to a quarter note, or a bar, or whatever, per loop. And the loops can be different lengths and each loop replays when it reaches its own end, so the loops phase shift against each other. Of course you can record this punching in and out to the master timeline and edit it afterwards to create a full track. No other sequencer / host on earth has that flexibility. Of course you don't have to work with loops at all, or even quantize, if you prefer. You can also set a slot to play its clips in random order to create constantly evolving never repeating soundscape installations. It's... insane. Imagine having an unlimited number of hardware sequencers with different pattern lengths that you can mix in and out in realtime and also record every action you take. It's insane. Also, the routing possibilities are just as flexible IMHOTEP as Cubase, it's just that the interface is better thought out and clearer. (I don't know why people think Cubase is so complex. It's very simple, except it has an awkward workflow-inhibiting interface) The Ableton demo is fully functional except you can't save, so check it out. |
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Oh, the clips can be midi data or audio, if that isn't already clear. |
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I know, but I live off pocket money, soo..... |
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Oh yeah, and you don't have to prearrange your clips to get them to sound like in FL - just trigger them live in scene mode, hence the name Live. So it's very intuitive to build up a scene - you're working more with your ears than your eyes like other sequencers. I know that FL has a bastard live mode as an afterthought but it's horrible, just horrible. |
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i fucking love ableton live 4 it's pretty much all i use now. if live 5 is better, then i can't see how you could go wrong. |
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it's really quite intuitive. i do reference the manual every now and then. but actually it has this little info window, that pretty thoroughly explains the function of everything in the program. it's very easy to use. if you are familiar with Acid, i think it is very similar but much more versatile. |
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thank you for the good response... i am stuck... i don't know if i truly want to go software & hardware mix, like i have in the past... i'm willing to give up my insecurities however for a wonderful piece of equipment such as ableton... muwhahaha |
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I think it's one of the most powerful pieces of music software around....not a toy like f-loops or reason....not a complete head fuck like cubase or logic. Try Plugging in a real instrument...I use it with my bass, which i can't play to save my life....after i record something that sounds even remotely ok; warp markers can be used to tighten up the timing and all the envolopes and effects make it sound the nuts. I hate using timelines to sequence stuff, I tend to make neat and pretty patterns rather than exciting structures. Get a midi controller and jam in the clip view, which is really good for dj'ing with aswell. I blagged a copy off a top geezer on here a few months back, now i'm addicted i will be buying the real deal soon. |
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Agreed. It's one of the few things where I actually use improvised material in finished tracks. It practically demands that you just play around, recording the audio and/or events and then afterwards pick out the good bits and tidy it up. Evolume: Agreed on the Acid Comparison. Fleetmouse: Yep, Floops' Live mode is very much tacked on and not really any more 'live' than selecting pre-programmed patterns on a drum machine. |
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i paid for my copy and im happy i did !!! |
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You've got mail. |
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Dave, you remeber that as yet unfinished remix of carbonated? Well, i did that in reason. I don't think personally that reason is a toy. Just a matter of preference. But i do really want live 5, it seems to offer i few things that i need. : ) |
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I agree that Reason isn't a toy, plenty of commercial dance tracks have been done almost entirely in it. Sampler, synths, drum machine, fx, what more do you need? Same goes for Floops. In my book, any infinite-track VST/VTi host with a velocity sensitive piano roll isn't exactly mickey-mouse with the right plugins. I think the reason both these programs are slated is that they're easy to use, so a lot of people start making music with them, or as their first step after ejay and even if their composition is good (perhaps they come from a classical, or hardware background), the production tends to be a bit lacking as they are not that experienced/au fait with how to get the best sound out of software. Generally, by the time people progress to cubase/logic/etc. they've got the hang of that side of things, so there's already a kick in the right direction... |
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yeah reason and fl have their place , but its just as bad when people doggedly stick to them as when people slate anything done on them - remember nutters like plasticman and vibert use reason - though of course sire vibert samples from some rather tasty rolands..... and thats what i dislike about reason so much , the dry sound i guess... seems to sound either really weak or mega compressed/distorted w/scream or whatever its called. im sure every single grime track made on reason has employed that effect. i use ableton 5 (been with it since 3) and it is amazing. simple as. but you need a good arsenal of plug ins / hardware / soundcard and midicard to the most out of it....i have it with reaktor/maxmsp/operator/roland hardware etc and yeah i can do a fair bit of stuff to say the least. top for dj'ing too. yeah and the clips are genius. what often happens for example is say the intro bassline may work better with a beat that appears later on and so forth it's then literally no work to switch stuff around, above all its well fun. |
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i have used reason rewired to ableton in the past just to use the dope synths. and it's really fucking easy to rewire it to reason and any other rewire capable program. you can even rewire it to itself if that gets you off. |
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Certainly, I'm not one of these people who say, "Floops does everything I want, I'm never learning another program". I still use it for making the odd loop, despite having technically "better" gear now. |
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this is 1/5 reasons why i want to incorporate live 5 into my music... observe the setup... |
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5/5 |
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you need to buy some colour for your studio |
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Our little quoth is all grown up now. :wipes away tear: |
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force ... no but do you see why i want to incorporate something like live into my setup fleetmouse? love, mr. quoth |
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I'm a big fan of Ableton and Reason. Can't stand Fruity Loops. |
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I used to use both reason and fruity loops a few years back, and I know that it is possible to get really good sounds out of both of them if you put in enough effort (Like The Talented Mr Skink). Alas, Im a lazy bastard and so ended up using all the shiddy presets, looking at all the pretty wires and making rubbish tunes. I guess everyone has different working methods and requirements when it comes to sequencers... floops and reason would be much better if they had direct audio recording. (I Haven't looked at the updates for over a year, so they may well have that feature now) Quoth: I am utterly Jealous of you owning a Machinedrum and Juno....Well Jackson! |
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i think FL is a great little scratch pad. crank out a quick beat, then export the loop and mangle it in ableton. |
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Yeah, exactly. |
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i like ableton a lot |
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Is that the An200 or the Dx200? |
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It is the Yamaha AN200 Analog Physical Modeling Desktop Control Synthesizer |
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brilliant setup mate ! After reading this thread, i feel like getting the ol' ableton back into consideration |
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big up the VAIO btw :D |
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How do you like it? I have been trying to track down an DX200, but have had no luck :( Just wondering about the AN200. Haven't heard many first hand experiences. |
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fucking machinedrum. i will steal it from you. is it fun? i have a super duper roland 303 so neeeeeeh. sorry. and 2xrackmount Nord G2 engines.... but yeah live with midi hardware is amazing .... looping about mental acid patterns with nutty breaks never fails. |
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i am putting my down payments on the Nord Modular G2X synthesizer... so my Roland Juno 60 will not feel left out, he'll have a little brother to share music creation with :) i am two months away from owning the guy :) i love my machinedrum...fuck man, i want to own another one so there could be twice the beat creation... muwhahahaha |
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to this date... i still have not got my attached image to control my an200... i think my midi settings on my computer are fucked up versus what is on my hardware... overall though, just think if i was able to control the an200 from my computer... how bad ass that would be, eh? fucking lush |
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Well, just connecting a midi cable through should let you control most of the CC's and notes, but the software editors and drivers for the an200 and the dx200 only have win98 supported, unfortunately. Aparently someone wrote a version for xp, but its not supported by yamaha, and its dodgy. Nord modular G2X!! That, the machine drum and a juno 106 are on my 'next to buy' list :) |
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nice to see you quoth... |
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would i only plug the midi cable into the "MIDI IN" on the AN200, since i only want to control the machine from the computer? i have both midi cables hooked up right now, but nothing is working... also I am using a MIDIMAN UNO 1X1 cable on a mac ox 9.2 system... should i use something completely older than that? any help on this would be much appreciated |
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yes, you too phobiazero. indeed. |
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