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I think in the 00's musicians are moving away from samples, and more towards programming tunes from scratch. Timbaland is a good example of this in hip-hop. |
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if you mean samples as in entire loops, ripped of from a song a la Puffy daddy, yes but samples in music will always remain |
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must agree with zeus. A lot of the synthesised sounds in modern music today are also sampled. Hell ,when making a mixdown everything gets recorded to wave/aiff for further treatment with plugins. Though I agree with you that the tendency in (popular)Hip Hop these days is more electronically inspired. A lot of Korg triton presets also, which I fucking hate! |
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samples for natural sounds, synthesizers for fat, digital, fm tunes.. |
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I don't know, both are good. |
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synthesis is underrated, less peoples of this world really use the power of FM. and yeah, like kluizenaar (cool name) said, samples can sound like synthesized tunes.. |
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I think it's funny that you use TIMBALAND as an example. For the record, Timbaland is one of the biggest sacks of talentless shit out there right now. Also, I am on the same page as Zeus. |
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timbaland is one of the only popular hip hop producers who is doing anything interesting with beats and melody. listen to the first 6 or so tracks of the most recent Timbaland & Magoo album. Lyrically, i concede that the album is pretty mediocre but the programming is very original and groundbreaking for the Pop music genre. also, the track "Indian Carpet" (i think its called) has some fine examples of incorporating unlikely samples into hip hop. |
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that's wrong, check tipper, rjd2, dj shadow. not popular, but good. |
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hmmm, I think hiphop is more hiphop when there's only turntables and scratching, not too much computerstuff. It has to stay raw IMO |
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ok, to add to the Hip Hop conversation. The only Hip Hop I like at the moment is any production from Madlib . Check out : quasimoto now if you've never heard of 'em! |
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Quasimoto "the unseen" is a brilliant fucking album. Cheers kluizenaar! |
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map, i just meant "popular" like top 40, on american radio, mtv video's, mtv cribs etc etc like popular. Laserbeak, agreed, hip hop generally should have some turney's and scratching i.e. da raw shit. but thats what i was pointing out about Timbaland; that he is incorporating some experimental electronic sounds/beats/progressions and trying to do something new with the genre. also check his use of vocal layering. On the new timbaland magoo album especially. another Hip Hop guy who is trying to change things up I would say is BUsta Rhymes. he has a few tracks that don't even use 4/4 which is pretty much the standard time signature in hip-hop. |
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One of my fave things to do on a synth is polyphonic portamento (Juno-106). Samples can't do this and even monophonic portamento gets choppy when using multisamples. Gliding with one sample is fine, but is restricted, especially going up in pitch. -P |
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don't dis timbaland unless you can make beats that sound better (and prove it) |
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i really think synthesis is the way to go. firstly youve got heaps more control over every parametre of the sound. you can tweak it while its playing, automate it to change while its playing. and secondly it means you can create the exact sound you wont, instead of looking through thousands of samples till you find one close to what you want, then trying to manipulate that with fx untill its closer to what you want. i used fastracker and the like for years, have a collection of around 18 gig of samples. but since getting a few hardware synths and more recently getting into the ni range of vsti's, i couldnt go back to sample based tunes. i still use samples for most my drum work, although more recently ive even been synthesising them myself and them sampling them back in. ive never been into loops AT ALL. but yeeah, i think sampling plays a huge part, but those samples should be from an original source. and synthesis will always be the bigger part of my productions. |
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concept-wise, i go synth |
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I think it's apples/oranges. Sampling (to me) is taking a sound from the real world I hear that has interesting phonetic qualities (usually by minidisc) and integrating it with my track of music. Synthesizing is using a machine to create pitched tones (like traditional instruments) or FX and manipulating its parameters. Synths add the musical qualities of chords and tripped out effects, while samples introduce real world wavforms with dynamics that could never be (or would never be) synthesized (also tripped out). Sampling a synth or drum machine is going backwards. How about creating new music with your own sounds and tweaked instruments? or is that to creative to be popular? heh, i guess it's called underground for a reason. -Bored with copycats- =Equal= |
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you do remember that DR. DRE... CO-PRODUCED some of Trent Reznor's stuff off of THE FRAGILE? |
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...samplin is for fools, synthesis is for smarties :0) LIke anything sampling is just a tool to use...unfort. everyone and their sister is over using it. oh yea, puff daddy and the entire hip-hop community are no talents =) |
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i actually think that with so much emphasis on computer software..artists are moving more towards sampling...but not in the traditional sense, like taking a bit from another song and looping it... i mean like what artists like matmos do.. taking sampled sounds and affecting them and arranging them... which was something that wasnt as easy to do with hardware.. but i dont mean to say that artists are moving away from synthesis.. i think both sampling and synthesis will always be progressing together with the technology...and as zeus said, i think both will always be equally important in electronic music |
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that's not quite true. he assisted with the mixing of "even deeper", that's all. .....however, dre and trent have a few unreleased songs together. |
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ack.. i contradicted myself, i know... but anyways..as far as hip hop goes... anti pop claim to create all their sounds themselves..so theres a good example of completely synthesized hip hop... and dont forget push button objects.. oh, and el-p is pretty good at that too...though he intergrates a bit more samples into his stuff |
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In regards to: "timbaland is one of the only popular hip hop producers who is doing anything interesting with beats and melody." What? How about, no? He does some of the most GENERIC melodies AND beats ever. They're very, very redundant and just go nowhere. Sorry, I just don't see the 'magic' in Timbaland's 'music'. It's just boring. Not interesting. I don't see how there is anything that could be considered interesting in mainstream hiphop from a musical standpoint. |
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Mainstream as in the shit they play on MTV. |
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USACID, a few words to you: "...samplin is for fools, synthesis is for smarties :0)" Sorry ,but this is a bullshit statement! You are on a messageboard dedicated to one of the most talented musicians in the world , who is a sample-extraordinair. I agree that just using loops from Diana Ross records, like that loser puff daddy is very irritating and weak,.but to just dismiss all the other aspects of sampling with that is ignorant. Same for your sweeping generalisation about the whole Hip Hop community. I mean taste is a personal thing, but you have lots of gradations in modern Hip Hop music today. From the Hip Pop (top 40 rap music) to all the underground artists. |
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dj shadow, kid koala, kid606, and the avalanches are really inspiring sample-based artists |
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use both. |
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What of synthesised mimicry? Like trent singing "bet you thing this song is about you" on Star****er or Sleeper's vocal imitation of a beachboy's song on "Nice Guy Eddie", I often copy sounds from other tracks even thought they're synthesised from scratch and the tune may be different... |
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a load of software synths & modules let you use sample waveforms as part of the synth....so you can get the best of both worlds...My old TG500 (2 sy85 plus 1MB RAM sample memory) lets you do this and transformed that machine for me... You can get soem real creative shit that way.... |
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u need to chill man, get laid or somethin. A few words? seemed more like a feature story, but hey...i guess u have a ton of time on u'r hands... ps Hiphop should die tomarrow |
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Hey each to their own eh? Personally I can dig both the synthetic new shit from Timbaland and Neptunes and also the sampled genius of, say Premier, (Gangstarr) etc. Just relax and enjoy it all, that's what it's there for! |
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