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 (nobody)...and 664 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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A lot has been said about Ableton Live here, ranging from "the only sequencer worth paying for" right through to "djing for people with no skill". It has also become a bit of an icon for piss taking, in the same way that powerbooks were a couple of years back; a real cliche of an IDM set... So, imagine my suprise when I saw this. Not Pendulum "Live" or Pendulum "DJing", but Pendulum "Ableton Set". Are they sponsored by Ableton? Or as I suspect, are they too ashamed to call selecting pre rendered loops in Ableton "Playing Live" or even DJing? Who knows? Incidentally, I hope they don't have that mincer of a dancer like last time I saw them. Real "break someone's face" evil dnb, with the total juxtaposition of a skinny aussie chav-looking bloke bobbing up and down out of time to the music, with camp arm movements. |
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Nottingham's First Indoor Festival first, should that apostrophe be there and second.. the first indoor festival in Nottingham ever?! What's up with Nottingham? |
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search here and find. |
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i've been messing around with the demo. it looks okay (should get a lite version today when UPS turns up with my MicroKontrol - yessss). i thought one of the main benifits of Live was being able to edit live, so if someone where improvising with Live live, for example, that would surely require more skill. but i see what you mean. i guess people are treating it as a glorified version of dance ejay. i can't really comment too much as i'm not familliar with the software. |
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Yes. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a cracking bit of software and very clever indeed. I just can't help but feel that I'm "cheating" when using it, it's that easy. I know quotes like, "I just can't help but feel that I'm "cheating" when using it, it's that easy." are the sort of thing marketing men lap up and plaster all over adverts, but for me it's not really a good thing. It just feels a bit empty/soulless. An analogy would be sticking something in a CAM lathe and hitting go on the computer and have it cut out your design as you specified, rather than you doing it by hand on a normal lathe. You can certainly do some clever improv with Live and it's extremely versatile (you can play live with it, DJ with nothing other than a copy of it, use it as a sampler, etc.), however, and this is probably why it's become a bit of a target for piss taking, is that an awful lot of artists just prerecord loops, arrange the bulk of the track in the arrangement view (the one that looks/acts like ejay) and then just click to trigger a few samples/drum fills on the session view. |
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The ad is probably correct on both accounts. The festival belongs to Nottingham, hence the apostraphe. Also, I can well believe that they've not had an "indoor" (or for that matter, outdoor) festival. |
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Ableton Live is fucking easy to mix with. It leaves you more time for audio fuckery though I suppose. Listen to zilty radio set to hear some of it. It's just an extension of mixing. What I'd really like is to hook it up to some decks and loop shit as it comes in and apply the effects and just fuck with the audio hardcore style. |
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abelton is fucked i can't figure out how the fuck to keep the tempo at what i want for created loops. can somebody tell me how they create drums loops or melody loops etc before they load it into abelton as a wav loop? |
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i make a loop. then export it. |
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yeah i hear you totally. i'm hoping with my microkontrol i'll be able to improv/jam along to whatevers going on and make/record beats on the fly. i've seen quite a few live acts that are just push button artists and its not very inspiring, regardless of the music itself. i dont mean to blow my own trumpet but i guess it helps that i can actually play an instrument. i'm keen to find out its possibilities cos i really wanna start doing some live music. and by live i mean 'live'. live music has soul and feeling. who knows i might even do a live version of what the beat...... |
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I thought it was Nottinghams when it was something that belonged to Nottingham while Nottingham's would be something like "Nottingham is [...]"? however, I am norwegian. |
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It's both. For example; "Nottingham's shit." (meaning "Nottingham is shit")and "Nottingham's inhabitants don't have one brain cell between them." It would be "Nottinghams" if there were several different places called Nottingham and you were refering to the them collectively. If something belongs to all of the several places called Nottingham, it'd be Nottinghams' or, if you follow the different (to my mind, more clumsy) style, Nottinghams's is also technically correct. You even get some people who use "Nottinghamses" for that, but even if that's not wrong (which personally, I reckon it is), it's arguably a lot less elegant than Nottinghams'. Here ends the grammar lesson. Hope this helps. |
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I read an interview with Monolake (co-founder of Ableton) once in which he said there were plans to have artists include the word Ableton on their CDs if they used the programmme. I don't know if that actually happened, but it obviously did in this case. It seems silly... Then again, I've seen many bands 'thank' the manufacturers of their gear (guitars, drums etc) in the liner notes. I bet they get paid for that as well. Laughing stock? Ableton is used by lots and lots of respected musicians, as far as I know... |
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I think its great in principle, in practice for dance music I tend to find Ableton sets to be consistently less enjoyable than DJing or Traktor sets. I dont see the problem with saying 'Ableton set' on the flyer because its just being honest, I think calling it 'live' is probably a bit of stretch for most Ableton performers. I've fiddled with it but I don't know how to use it really, hopefully I'll get round to it soon because it looks like a lot of fun. |
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I think when I get my stuff together, and play live, I'll be using ableton. I'd probably take all my tracks that I've written, export each seperate track as audio, and cut them up into loops, so I can do real time remixing and arrangements, live. I think that would be ideal. As far as composing with it, I'm not really interested. |
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never got on with ableton theres just something irritating about it. |
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ableton is a great program, i'm just starting to use it now and i'm learning about all of the little tricks etc, but i think the 'too easy' part is the best part of the program. Its very straight to the point & easy to use...and if you don't think that an 'ableton live set' doesn't sound as good as a tracktor or dj set, maybe the act you're listening to is just learning it and doesn't know the full potential they have with it.. for me the program works so well so your not sitting there glued to the monitor you can map anything to a midi controller and actually play your parts live etc. i'm really diggin the real-time aspect of it...its just as immediate as playing live music with a guitar in a band which is what i'm use to...only know i'm the band :) |
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I'm not for one moment suggesting Live sounds worse than Traktor/DJing. It usually sounds better because you'd actually have to be trying to get Live to fall out of synch with itself, whereas even good people make the odd mistake with Traktor/DJing. In terms of actually going to see an act I'd prefer to watch someone use Ableton rather than DJing (unless it was turntabilism). For the audience, it's great. I just meant that for myself, when I'm making it, it's somehow unfullfiling. I do really like the immediacy of it and the way you can record and sequence midi and audio so seamlessly. |
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it could be that, but its more that I think though real time arranging sounds like a good idea, most people end up making tracks that lack structure |
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It's the endless cycle of the musical herd. Everyone jumps on a bandwagon until it's too popular and generic, then someone else finds another way and the herd decides that's the exciting new thing. The artists who stand out will be the ones not using Ableton. Same goes with every other fad. Oops, I can smell another one that just went stale. Are we all tired of acid tinged neo-electro-techno yet? I know I am. I think ix_ten is onto something with his big beat. Let's do that until it gets too popular again. What the beat. What-what the beat. |
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Funny you say that, because I was actually thinking of doing some big beat earlier today... |
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I've been doing all this micro sampled stuff recently trying to bite the jelinek style. Need a change of pace. Big beat it is. |
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"Fleetmouse and Ceri JC; defining the new direction of excellent electronic music" |
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what you said there applies to "its" and "it's"... not to proper nouns though. |
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hmm.. good to know. |
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Live makes looping easier, but doesnt make your songs good or bad, the artist does. I really like using the mix view for sequencing tracks. You dont have to look at that goddamn timeline. |
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I think I may have said that I want to hear your stuff before, but I'm saying it again I wanna hear your stuff. |
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Pendulum's garbage anyway. |
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the big beat renaissance is here... |
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yes, i would agree ableton is easy... but it's easy in the fact that you have a generic layout of of how you input the music you want to output. ideas used in Live can be manipulated know one would have ever dreamed of before... this is why i choose to use it as a piece of my musical puzzle. ideas sprawl from the actual synths and drum machines and my voice and then i manipulate it, rerun it through to a cd recorder and then load it into a sampler, chop it up again and again and again, load it into MOTU Digital Performer and chop it up in there and then finally, maybe reroute some parts of the audio to my nord modular g2 and then play the stuff as a synth in the end. ableton is nice for me because it's a way to route my music through my computer and be able to bend the sound any which way i see fit. COMPLETE HEAD FUCKERY. |
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I only have the demo version which i mess with sometimes. i recorded a few bits to MD one night because of the lack of save and export WARNING they are blatent early autechre rips (in style not quality :) |
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an example of Ableton being used by a "major artist" is Trent Reznor. he's openly said that he used Ableton Live quite a bit during the making of WITH_TEETH. that album, compared to his earlier stuff is shit (imo). i personally don't like working with loop samples, as i feel that there's not enough control over everything. that's why i love MIDI (and yes i know that Ableton Live now handles MIDI sequencing). i'm determined to get my head around Notator for the Atari. i think i've gotten the jist of it, i just need to put it into practice now. |
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i like abelton cause i can have a whole set done before i even go on stage and just hit play and look like i'm doing stuff |
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live is a tool just like any other software or instrument. the results will speak for themselves. someone arguing that a tool is making things to easy is a bit silly. if pendulum plays a good set, they play a good set, no matter what they use. i think that if things are made "easier" than perhaps new results will yielded, as this may cause the artform to become more approachable. much in the same way that having the ability to use personal computers with software made making electronic music more accessable compared to having to have access to hardware. on one end, this may dilute the quality of a genre as a whole. however, i still believe that giving more people access to music will yield more music for more perspectives, generating new music. |
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I would like to hear DJ Ableton's thoughts about it |
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like any piece of software, you get out of it what you are willing to put into it. I've used it for DJing, Laptop Battling, and Composing. This is what i love about Live, it is so versatile and, I think, user friendly. |
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