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 (nobody)...and 198 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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aha, it should be in that cat topic |
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Salvia is not drug but a KEY, a living, growing conciousness, that went ingested, communicates with us to show us realities and sensations that defy comprehension, allows us to access to answers we are not yet capable of understanding. I firmly believe that one full on experience with this plant/entheogen holds more spiritual manna than a lifetime of church going, (or your local alternative). I tried it at Christmas 'piggy backed' with E, 'phets, absolut vodka, weed and about 60 magic mushrooms. Then we smoked some Sally. It was frankly amazing, imagine reality being squashed between 2 panes of glass then the panes of glass moving about slowly, spreading the reality onto the 2 panes. Well by that time there were multiple realities, all very real, all very 'museum tour' like. As if we were on a guided tour of the cosmos. Me and fellow cosmonaut for the evening came to the conclusion that 'this' reality the one we are in right now, is not the only one there is, there are many other and in actual fact this 'life' as we call it is merely a distraction, a sideshow to the main event. All very comforting and warm to be honest. I would recommend it to anyone who has had good hallucinogenic experiences in the past and can handle sudden reality shifts, cause thats what you'll get. |
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What the fuck are you talking about you fucking gleet face. |
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i got so fucking fucked up the other day taht i almost understood reality. |
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good story. i'm very curious, but i'll try salvia when i feel the time is right. i think i should experience a level 5 mushroom trip first.. lots of people will give you crap for saying that, but i know why you refer to this plant as a key and not as a 'drug'. referring to magic mushrooms as drugs feels just as wrong to me. |
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ha ha ha ha It's just the drugs. If you're looking for that kind of "woah, we are all one with the cosmos, reality is but an illusion, woah" thing when you're tripping then i guess you're more predisposed to "find" it on salvia. It doesn't mean there really is a secret reality than only you cosmonauts know about. I repeat: it's just the drugs. |
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hahahahahaha..I"ll never use this..and i've used a lot |
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The thing about a lot of Salvia experiences is that al lot of them have VERY similar, if not identical, themes and descriptions. I find it hard to believe that people from all over the world can unite and have such similar experiences to one another, disregarding background, lifestyle, surroundings, personality, etc etc. Salvia cuts through this, with a definitive edge. And yes you are right it is the drug/key/plant affecting my brain, but the effects are quite simply too real, too plausible, too perfect, repeatable, friendly warm and welcoming to be anything but an alternate reality. After all we are capable of so much more in the brain department, we just have to push the right buttons.. Sometimes it is better NOT to try and understand, to be controlled by our relentless ego, but to let go and allow ourselves to become part of something bigger, infinitely more ancient and esatblished than any of us, as single entity could ever hope to surpass. |
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';' |
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What the fuck arre you talking about you fucking gleet face. |
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That's true from what i've read on people's experience with the stuff, they often are quite similar. I know every time i've smoked salvia at high concentrations, the effects have definitely been quite similar to what you describe. Could it be possible this is because people are using the same drug with it's own ways of interacting with the brain? And often a standardized extract? Maybe. Could it be there really are alternate realities that only hallucinogen-users can find? Maybe, but i think i know which one i believe. After all, just because you see your hand turn into a beef steak on acid, doesn't mean it's really happening. I find it a bit silly to believe that the strange things you experience after you've taken a load of psychedelics are a "hidden reality". It's not fighting the "flow" or whatever, it's just common sense. Maaaan. |
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true, everyone is entitled to their own opinions maaaaan, but booze effects people quite differently, as does ganj, the effects of salvia are much more refined and direct. However when Death extends its boney digit, it will feel familiar and i definitely do not fear it. and im saying this, not on salvia |
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this you can only truly know when you do feel "the boney digit", to propose it now has little value. |
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as deepspace says, it could also just be a very specific drug, hitting specific parts of the brain and therefore creating the same experiences. |
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I like what you're saying. I am in between camps. One one hand I think a large majority of spiritual experiences with drugs are fairly chemically based, whereas on the other I like to think that some substances have the potential to unlock parts of our conciousness that we don't use in normal life. After all, we only use something like 25% of our brainpower don't we? I think its perfectly plausible that revelations can occur when untapped parts of the brain are stimulated. The whole religious/spiritual thing I'm more skeptical about. |
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have you made your avatar using salvia? that would be great |
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"After all, we only use something like 25% of our brainpower don't we?" no, this is popular myth - but myth nonetheless. long, long ago when I used to study psychology this was one of the fun little facts that was first to be debunked. :) you use quite a lot of your brain and the rest seems to be there on stand-by - when your speechcentre fails, another part of your brain will adapt and become a new speechcentre (or something that comes close to it..). |
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the speechcentre thing is an example, I'm not saying I prophesise clint's speechcentre to fail in the nearby future. |
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I don't disagree that drugs (and especially hallucinogens) can give you some quite powerful revelations, but i don't think it's due to "untapped areas" of the brain being brought into play. I think mushrooms, lsd and mdma (plus quite a few more) affect the same receptor in the brain, just in different ways. Although to be fair, the receptor that salvia affects is quite poorly understood at the moment as i understand it. I could be wrong i suppose. It'd be interesting to see how different areas of the brain are affected on psychedelics under a cat scan or something. I'm sure somebody must've done that. |
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i can appreciate why some individuals would opt for a model which views human beings as electrochemical machines operating in a four dimensional reality. the drug experience, then, is seen as essentially a machine malfunction resulting from the transitory presence of the drug. it's a very popular model. however, there is plenty of reason to believe that reality is not limited to four dimensions, and that what we know as reality is far larger and incomprehensible than our little models of it. there is also a vast history of spirituality which is not dependent on drug experiences. i'm not saying that anyone's right or wrong, as everyone is responsible for their own experience and their own models, they do as they will. to suggest that there's no point in discussing these issues because no one "knows" the truth is a disappointing cop out. to blindly dismiss these experiences as meaningless seems as misguided as assuming that they are necessarily meaningful. arrogance isn't much better than naivete... |
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oops, i wasn't necessarily addressing qrter entirely... |
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well that sums it up pretty well. i wish we could all agree that this is the end of this thread. well spoken, plaidzebra. |
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No way, I have bin using that one in conversation ever since a school trip on which the strange geek kid told the dorm that if he could utilise the full power of his brain he could stab everyone by willing a knife with his mind! |
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most drugs replicate possible natural chemical reactions in the brain, though - which would explain the "there is also a vast history of spirituality which is not dependent on drug experiences" point, perhaps. an example - studies have shown that people who are dying and don't get enough oxygen to the brain, suddenly release a large amount of endorphins, which creates the experience of seeing a seering white light and a feeling of great happiness. this could be an explanation for near-death experiences. and I don't agree on the idea that the drug would cause the machine to malfunction - just to function differently. however - because this only happens when taking drugs (leaving the natural experiencing of spiritual thingies for a moment) I wouldn't take it for the gospel. when you have the flu and hallucinate because of it, you do not tend to see these hallucinations as anything but just that. however - although you weren't strictly "follow-upping" to me - I wasn't saying these experiences therefore have to be seen as not being meaningful - in fact, I didn't even hint at it! how you interpret these chemical reactions is up to you - I'm aware this might sound pedantic, but I really don't mean it that way. I think we are basically lots of shifting neurological connections and nothing more - that said, this system of neurological connections is so incredibly complex and intricate, this of itself is amazing enough for me. |
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hahah hm um.. |
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what the fuck.. those videos are gay. that dude probably smokes crack or something. |
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i'm not out to persuade anyone of anything, just to put in my two cents... by malfunction i meant to reflect that many who question the validity of so called "drug experiences" are biased to see "different function" as "malfunction." it's not easy producing a reader's digest version of a complicated, messy idea. there's no question that i've gone down a path that i can't back out of, but that is flexible and unpredictable. i spent a lot of energy trying to hold on to an agnostic but fundamentally scientific materialist viewpoint. to be honest with myself, i had to abandon that model. and along with that i had to learn that our collective situation is such that no words on my part will ever suffice to persuade or change anyone's mind about who they are or why they exist, except to offer encouragement and ideas for those who are facing a similar situation, or to offer an alternative to those who are operating self-destructive beliefs. qrter, i think there's a lot to discuss in your post, and much i would like to address, but there just isn't time and an xltronic reader's digest version will not do... a message board can a great tool for practicing winnowing ideas down the absolute minimum essence, though... |
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i got some pretty good effects from a cigarette of salvia leaves with 10x extract on there. none of my trials have resulted in as profound an experience as some i've heard recalled, though. mostly i got perceived entity contact, some time distortion, flowing-type visuals in woodgrain, and general change in consciousness. it's kinda tight but i probably won't do it much anymore except as a booster. |
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this is a fascinating topic. I have a (sort of) salvia experience from two years back, but that was barely interesting. I didn't take enough to get anywhere. I have friends who've done it, and their (rather unsettling) experiences have postponed my interests in taking it anytime in the near future. I personally have had little doings with substances of this sort, ever. Some lovely experiences with cannabis constitute the extent of my "in the know"-ness. As far as "it's just the drugs" vs. "a different reality" topic is concerned, I see why plaidzebra would want to argue vehemently against the oft-repeated scientific arguments like the ones that are popular amongst neuropsychologists and all sorts of neo-freudians. Firstly, the neuroscientists see patterns of activity in brain-scans and claim to see it as "fully operational". This apparent "refutation" of the "myth" of undeveloped human potential is just another myth, a second-order myth, because it's based on superficial analyses of stripes of colour on computer screens. That said, there's no point in giving percentages here: 5%, 22%, 98%, 100%... I mean, we're using 100% in a way ALL THE TIME, but that 100% CAN be pretty fucking miserably spent. Secondly, the (neo-)freudians and other boring exponents of "normalcy" are just working against all deviation from their concepts of what constitutes healthy living. This includes their denial of the reality of all sorts of mental states currently denigrated as "schizophrenic", "paranoiac", "psychotic", "neurotic" etc. Both of these groups are outdated and boring; Well, Freudians more outdated and mainstream neuroscientists rather boring. I see much of this as symptoms of post-Christian nihilistic ethos. Anybody who has any concept of a "will" should know that CHOOSING the most uplifting course of action is a deed left to the individual: That's why I applaud any "-nauts" who venture on where few have gone before (whether psychonauts, astronauts or arsonauts <-- that m |
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*krhm* I was saying: "... arsonauts <-- that means ART-exploring, you dumbass)" |
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haha |
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arsestronauts? |
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it was already funny at arsonaut... |
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yeah, i kinda fzcked that one up didn't i? sorry guys.. |
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