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In future land battles... I know we've been long time allies, but it now seems that we're going to just have a small (comparatively) elite army/navy and rely on the USA to make up the numbers. Its been going this way for a while and wasn't exactly unexpected, but I didn't think it would happen this soon. The official reason for this is to have a series of "small, quickly deployable forces aimed specifically for counter terrorist operations". So, nothing to do with halving our defense spending them? Ho hum, looks like the next time there's a Saddam to give a kicking to, we won't even have the option of disagreeing to any extent with America :/ |
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how much is this going to cost you? |
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Canada relies on the US as far as military is concerned too... it's a nice set-up! :) |
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haha, this will help getting bush a bigger military budget...wont he be one happy boy? :) |
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Smaller army? Bet our annual £30billion defence budget don't get any smaller as a consequence. The US are already criticising NATO and European governments for not spending enough on defence. Mind you, with their defence spending now topping $400billion a year you can see the disparity. Fucking 400 Billion A YEAR!!! Still don't stop the cunts being picked off with $50 RPGs by a few goat herders does it? |
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what's your source on this? |
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Geoff (Baf)Hoon just announced it in parliament. |
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BBC... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3308629.stm Peloton: The uk forces have already had defence cuts year on year for the past 20 odd years... down from just over 5% to just under 2.5% of the GNP. I know you might see that as a good thing, but the reality of it is that there will be greater amounts of conflict if we have a smaller military. |
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"... the reality of it is that there will be greater amounts of conflict if we have a smaller military." How so? Are there leaders of other nations sitting there thinking 'damn, if the didn't UK have such a big army I'd invade'? I don't think our army is a deterrant to other nations doing what they want either. Like Zimbabwe |
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Quite frankly our alliance with the States is a clever one. Bush has fucked up badly post Iraq conflict. I totally supporting the war though but the way its been handle post end war has been amaterish by both Bush and Blair. Quite frankly with an ally such as the States we don't need a big army. We use to rule the seas and so use to control the world but times have moved on. Britain can be a force for good and change in the future by having a strong foreign policy coupled with economic change in poor and war torn countries. Our alliance with the States is the right one. Fact is we are the weaker partner but who cares. France and Germany stick together, the French have had their arses whipped for the last 1000 years by us so they're never going to be on side period, Germany well they're workable. Blair is wasting his time with the French, his efforts should be geared towards Russia and the States end of story. |
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A smaller army presence on our part would mean more friendly fire (sorry America, but your troops are ever so trigger happy compared to ours...), greater civilian casualties (same reason) not to mention our forces being stretched thinly in many places... I think the best way to avoid groundwar is to have an army so immense and powerful (like America's) that even the most deluded crackpot dictator would never even attempt to go against them. |
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good god, what are we joining in...eu is nothing but hatred i'll have some joy till may '04 now |
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For years we've been used primarily for our special forces by the USA, this just seems a lot less overt than that and makes me uneasy. If we ever did decide to side with "The United States of Europe" (talking about 20-50 years from now) if it came down to a EU vs. American war (I doubt it will) we would be "stuck" with America if we had no large force of our own. Also, we're an island- it makes sense to have a half decent navy. |
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EU vs. American war its been said this couldnt happen in democratic countries...cos usually sane people get elected that says it all really... im going to retire to my shelter now |
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"A smaller army presence on our part would mean more friendly fire casualties " That don't add up. Surely a larger army would create a bigger target? More casualties? Same goes with respect to more civilian casualties. Can't see how having a samller army would increase these figures. "I think the best way to avoid groundwar is to have an army so immense and powerful (like America's) that even the most deluded crackpot dictator would never even attempt to go against them." Yeah, but that just leads to an arms race. Every nation and his grandmother trying to precure nuclear/chemical/biological weapons to deter an attack from the greater powers. |
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hahaha you guys are fucked |
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I'll get some flack from the american for this (ho ho, what a pun), but the yanks have a real problem with friendly fire and generally blowing the shit out of anything that moves... I'm not just saying this based on news reports- several of my friends who've served with the Americans state the same thing- the vast majority of the grunts have a gung ho, shoot 'em up attitude unbecoming of a professional soldier. Less highly trained UK troops (yes, we have the longest and most intense basic training in the world) = more american troops in that place to do the job = less tact and diplomacy and more wanton shooting. |
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As to the arms race, I think we all know america is mcdaddy, even if their troops leave a bit to be desired. |
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the UK is so totally becoming the 51st state. Not just in terms of political alliances but also culturally. It's quite sad. |
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We live in civilised times. It takes a lot for a Western country to go to war. The French have been at odds with the British since time began. I just think we have to be selfish about things and see whats in our interest and that means allying with the States. The EU is only a means for Germany and France to run a European empire by stealth. That is the undercurrent of it, has been and always will be. The French feel inferior and like to imagine their top gun, they ain't. They don't amount to a row of beans. They've got an inferiority complex and thats why they're at odds with the States and Britain. |
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Yes, I'd rather we were airstrip one as opposed to part of the "United States of Europe" as well. I'd just prefer to have the option to switch sides if we ever needed to... |
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TonyFish, Thats where it all begins by developing an inferiority complex. The States is number 1 and its very straight forward we need to be their allies. I mean come on are you serious you wanna be allies with France? Perlease! They've been throwing mud in our faces for the last fifty years, you'd have to be mad to cow tow to them. They're completely unreliable, thats the background, thats the reality. |
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Yes, as much as I like the french as a people, politically their one of the most selfish countries around... |
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The French have been at odds with the British since time began Ahem. Vice versa. Having lived in both countries I can assure you that in the UK anti french feeling is rapant everywhere including the media whereas in all my time living over here I have never heard anything along these lines I assure you. But hey this isn't exclusive to France. The english love to tear pretty much any other nation apart. I suppose it's some kind of reaction to the tip you live in. Maybe it's time you guys stopped putting all your energies into petty racism and military alliances and did something about the shit hole you live in. You know, small things like public transport (I'm sure funkmaster will agree!), education and health. Things that *really* mater. ah why do I bother. forget it. |
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I like the french public transport system. The Paris Metro is an examplary service. |
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well it's probably not as clean as London (following some terrorist attacks a while back when all the bins were sealed) but anyway it's way more efficient (even during massive strikes) |
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someone release cannon fodder 3 already. |
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were allies, and thats it |
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Exactly. Lol. Tonyfish, we owe the French nothing, they owe us everything. Remember that next time you criticise yours trully. |
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care to elaborate on that? |
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WW2 ring any bells?! |
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Yes extremely handy being a island isn't it? *rolls eyes* |
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Yes |
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How much to advertise on your avatar then? |
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A white feather and a big bag of garlic |
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No on Tony Fish's avatar. |
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I know..... I don't want a cowardly white feather, or a big bag of garlic. |
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I like garlic, love the smell of it. Drives me mad! |
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I think you mean the French have a Napoleon complex. BadumTish. Actually, As with Australia, the US is British in it's roots. The alliance runs deep hundreds of years. |
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Yeah I'd agree with that. |
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by that logic I could say Britain owes the US because we saved their asses in WWII all the same....and i dont dig that. |
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And the US owes france because of our contribution to the american war of independence which was a decisive factor in the american victory. And who were the americans and french fighting? The british. This 'owing' this is lame. Enough looking into past... |
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We owe the meteor 'cause it wiped out the Dinosaurs and we came in in their place. |
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That's a good point. Thank you France., btw.., but once the revolution was over we got on with our british lifestyle. |
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haven't you guys read 1984? in it britain is part of the u.s. while europe and asia are the other too forces tonyfish: oweing france for the war of independance? how 'bout D-day..jesus |
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who said owe? |
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I hate politicians so much. |
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There was no American war of independance. It was simply the English over there at war with the English over here. |
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no there was a shit load of germans too.. and they was plentty of intermarrige with indians |
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