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I am listening to 'Kontakte' it sounds a bit like Merzbow, Noise music and ambient music... It is nice and all and very refreshing compared to the electronic music i usually listen to. But i seriously don't get it. How is this more than a bunch of (nice) electronic noises? What is the concept behind it? |
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What else do you need? |
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A short introducing into music theory |
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it's moreso music history you're looking for. specifically, during the time when electronic music was really first being explored, there were the french and the german schools. the french were experimenting with musique concrete, essentially what's become sampling. tape loops being played out of phase (pierre henry's "come out" is the most well known example of this), found sounds being turned into percussive loops, etc. on the other end you had the germans who were working with synthesized sound. stockhausen was the pioneer of serial music and synthesizer orchestrations, creating a new kind of music out of math that no human player could reproduce. he was basically trying to see what new interesting music we could create when we weren't bound by writing notes which could be physically played by a person. he also experimented with novel forms of notation and instrumentation. one notable piece was "played" by two people, one playing a gong and the other moving a microphone in predetermined patterns around the gong, eliciting novel timbres. of course, none of it turned out to be any good in terms of pleasurable listening. of the three godfathers of modern experimental music - the other two being pierre henry and john cage - i find stockhausen was the one who was least concerned with actual aesthetics, and not nearly as enjoyable. disclaimer: the majority of this information is from one "history of electronic music" class i took at uni 8 years ago in a fog of marijuana smoke, so there could totally be some wrongness in there :P |
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Explain Stockhausen to you? Pretentious shit, there you go! |
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like what is this shit?!? |
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i bet its worse explaining monoid to stockhausen |
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It is art! Now please go away. The Daft Punk thread is over there! |
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I saw these play the other night and they were |
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Thanks for the information. I however don't understand why you would want to compose music if it is not a pleasurable to listen to. Now, maybe this is a narrow way of looking at things, maybe these experiments are breaking new aesthetic ground. |
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Quote "a bunch of (nice) electronic noises" that's enough for me. |
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here, come see my collection of interesting electronic noises!! this noise i found under a staircase. it smells odd. this noise has blue fur. this noise was developed by the military, for purposes of national security. this noise i haggled for fiercely at a bazar in jerusalem. this noise is a bit skittish and mangy; i keep it in a dark room and scream at it through a crack in the door two or three times a week. this noise is why einstein's hair went white. this noise is why brian eno is bald. would you care for a sip of some 10yo barrel-aged brown noise? |
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Well art is in the eye of the beholder... and what, Daft Punk isn't art? But this guy's experiments are? |
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IS ART. ISN'T ART. why must we be so binary, mr. daft punk? perhaps, in the 60s, john cage was 86% art, but in 2013, the same techniques yield a mere 13% art, due to artistic inflation. |
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This guy's experiments are great, without people like him you would still be hanging in a tree eating bananas, If you criticize him I don't think you should be listening to electronic music. |
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Hey, man- nothing wrong with hanging in trees and eating bananas. I'd do it now, but I gotta get my forearms much stronger to hang for 20 minutes with one hand. somewhat relevant: |
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I am not going to bash Daft Punk. But ART, as far as you can define this term, shouldn't mean easily to digest music you listen to for entertainment purposes. Art should try to push the boundaries of what we find aesthetical pleasing and maybe not so pleasing. Everythink else is just craftmanship |
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The liner notes in my Kontakte LP mentions that sound around 17' in where a tone slows down to become rhythmic pulses; this recording apparently the first of its kind to do it this way. Also he translated techniques from other forms, editing compositions like films (the "cinematic splice"). I think these methods are amplified when adopted by more emotional artists (Throbbing Gristle for example) |
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Says you, but explain to me how a painting of a vase full of sunflowers is pushing the boundaries of what we find aesthetically pleasing, yet such a painting, or series of paintings, by Van Gogh are considered masterpieces. Art is in the eye of the beholder! |
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"This guy's experiments are great, without people like him you would still be hanging in a tree eating bananas, If you criticize him I don't think you should be listening to electronic music. " I understand to some extent the fact that he is influential in electronic music. But I wonder, does this influence enter into and actually affect the music subsequent artists have made, or did it simply give people the idea of making music electronically? What if I were to pick up a rock and start banging it against the wall and called it music. Then say another person saw me doing this and started doing it themselves, but they had much better ideas and their execution was extremely good. Maybe I gave this person the idea he could do something creatively with a rock and a wall, but it doesn't mean I had anything to do with the quality of what he produced. Just because your first, doesn't necessarily mean anything. |
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You seem to be misunderstanding everyones points. There is art and there is craft. It's impossible to define 'art' properly but I see it as art provokes (good/bad/indifference/boredom/an emotion). Craft can be appreciated for a goal reached well. Stockhausen was art and sometimes craft. |
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I don't think I'm misunderstanding anyones points here, but maybe we have differing views of what constitutes art. |
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What constitutes art for you? |
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Van Gogh and others started modern art as far as i know. I guess he was an inovator in that sense. Now today of course it is hard to come up with something new, because people are used to these styles already. |
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You could have left it at "I don't think" really. |
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lol, is that your first jab at me here? I was wondering when you'd start. |
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Oh let's not bait - he's been surprisingly on topic this thread. |
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What if I were to pick up a rock and start banging it against the wall and called it music. Then say another person saw me doing this and started doing it themselves life in st. john's |
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It wasn't a 'jab', you haven't read and understood what anyone has said. Banging rocks against a wall? Hahaha. C'mon mate, use your loaf. |
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What points exactly am I not understanding? According to this thread it seems that Daft Punk is not art, yet Stockhausen is for some reason? I call bullshit on this. In a very general sense I think art can be any kind of creative exercise that evokes an emotional response of some kind. To me Daft Punk is just as much art as Stockhausen. And my comment about banging a rock against a wall wasn't even directed to you at all, I was just making a point about Stockhausens supposed influence on electronic music. |
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Many a many art discussions on xlt. Instead of posting them all, there's . |
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"to me.." Exactly! do you understand now? |
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"What if I were to pick up a rock and start banging it against the wall and called it music". you stole this idea from that monkey slamming bananas against a tree calling it music...that's not new nor creative.. It's not about who is first..it's all about the experiment itself..and stockhausen is doing that. I don't say that I like his music but I like people who dare to experiment..you shouldn't criticize them unless they are hurting people off course ;-) |
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I for got to unquote "What if I were to pick up a rock and start banging it against the wall and called it music". you stole this idea from that monkey slamming bananas against a tree calling it music...that's not new nor creative.. It's not about who is first..it's all about the experiment itself..and stockhausen is doing that. I don't say that I like his music but I like people who dare to experiment..you shouldn't criticize them unless they are hurting people off course ;-) |
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I think everyone is going slightly "off course". |
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Yeah, I think I've always understood. Just because someone in this thread says I'm not understanding the points doesn't mean they're right. All I've been saying in this thread has been my opinion, and I do think the concept of what is art is very much peoples personal opinions. I understand to some people Stockhausen is art, but to me Daft Punk is just as much art, more so. Who are you or anyone else to tell me that's wrong? |
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You 'think' you've always understood? or You 'know' you've always understood? There's a big difference. I know you are not the sharpest knife in the drawer and it might seem mean educating you publicly but you've been banging on about this for five days! Let it go, stop being angry, accept you said something that was provocatively stupid and move on. Problem solved! |
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lol, seems you're the angry one, since you can't seem to respond to any thread on this website without throwing insults like a child... |
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Your first little tantrum of the thread - "Explain Stockhausen to you? Pretentious shit, there you go!". Calm down love, you could have chosen to ignore the thread as you couldn't explain anything obviously. You chose to act on your base instinct and talk crap for five days. Saying "it's my opinion!", "it's my opinion!" like a frustrated twelve year old. |
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heh, well it is my opinion obviously, or am I speaking for the human race here? you need to chill out a bit and not get so worked up over things on the internet... |
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come on, you know you can't resist saying something else to me... you can't let me have the last word here can you?!? |
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Yes, it obviously is your opinion so there is no need to state it all the time. It's an ill informed opinion and poorly concluded but I wasn't expecting any less. |
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oh no, you don't like my opinion?!? :'( |
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It's not whether I like it or not, you genuinely don't know what you are talking about. The idiom you misquoted through sheer ignorance is actually "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder", not "Art is in the eye of the beholder" |
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I didn't misquote it, because I wasn't trying to quote it, hence the lack of quotations in my posts, idiot. Clearly you shouldn't be saying other people are stupid if you don't even understand basic English. |
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It's grammar and written English you are grasping to use now, not English. An idiom doesn't need quotation marks to be quoted. What are your thoughts on Marcel duchamp? |
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Funkmaster furiously looking up Marcel Duchamp... |
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I openly admit I don't know much about him. |
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Ok I admit I was trying to be a bit provocative with my first post in this thread. But give me a serious response to this, do you really not think this isn't pretentious crap? |
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