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 Now online (1)belb ...and 153 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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i don't have anything else to say. i just wanted to be on top of this page. |
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I feel absurd all the time and fucking love it. |
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Maybe it's not exactly the same thing, though. What do you feel exactly? |
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Hahah, I'm just mostly joking around a bit with existentialism (which is one of the philosophical directions I'm focusing on). I'm not really good at explaining all this, especially not in short version (language seems a bit insufficient at times, but attempting explanation is good practice), so this will be very lacking.. Absurdity refers to the feeling that the world is absurd or rather meaningless. The most extreme consequence of this would be suicide, but you also get people who face the absurdity, making their own meaning, etc etc. I haven't actually read this, but Camus' The Myth of Sisyphus deals with this. I don't think it's possible to give any sort of description of the feeling of absurdity over what has been said, it will always be a particularly personal experience, but if you've ever been depressed, even only mildly, or anything like that you should be familiar with it. It's not a particularly nice feeling, but it's possible to persist through it.. At least I'm still here... I know what you mean about loving the absurd, though.. I'm always most entertained by stuff that doesn't make sense to me, particularly japanese people, but that's a different (but similar) kind of absurdity. I feel there's a lot missing from this, but... oh well. |
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i was about to tell darius to read that. i recommend it, it helped me....feel less alone. |
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that's why it's hard for me to look at the big picture when it comes to anything school work life whatever i just see death and i go what for? where do you draw the line. ya know my dad want me to have a good life and finish school and get a good job and retire comfortably and what not but then i instantly get argumentative over why? we all die. me you everyone else. dead. what does it matter if i do this or have that or not? is this a race? who wins? that's when life becomes selfish i tel him. he wants to be nice and sympathetic and caring to others being ones who are less fortunate but at the same time just by his wanting "nice" things from life takes away from those same people. just by the design of democracy and capatalism. hypocrtically he wants both. to be able to "survive" by working to the top yet support those underneath but he doesn't feel those underneath him deserve anything if they don't work for it. that's when i ask where do you draw the line? you don't think anyone should be given anything but you think people should help other people by giving them things? is that all life is just a matter of drawing the line? looking at the big picture is a matter of drawing the line. why accomplish anything to get anywhere later in life to be more comfortable when we fucking die. it's a constant argument between him and i mostly because we are able to keep it purely philosophical. |
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what for? For whatever you think is valuable (value in a double sense). |
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what do i matter? what does anyone matter? we all die and what ever self righteous things we "wanted" were in vain and mean nothing after were gone. why don't we all just fuck everything to hell in that sense then? |
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Because we're able to make it matter to us. |
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No no no, I was talking about the absurdity and meaninglessness of existence too. I think it's great. I think life would be horrible if it had a point. Now I'm free, I don't have to care about anything at all if I don't want to, because there's no point in caring. I can appreciate life in a purely aesthetic way. It's fantastic. Of course sometimes I get depressed or panicked. I'm not perfect and there's still a lot of work to do in order to shake off this omnipresent feeling of being part of something bigger and meaningful, because that's how our society goes and that's how we were all brought up, but I think it's the only way to real happiness. And freedom, FREEDOM |
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well then i guess i just fail to care [as much]. i try not to want because it can be taken away, and really that seems to be the bane of our existence, "what i could have" (ie: want). people steal and people kill, for why? because they matter more? no. shits fucked up and i need not worry my pretty little head over anything but what i eat and where i sleep. everything else is a gift and a luxury. |
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oh and when it's finally all over, good ridance. |
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Hm.. I'm not really sure from what you've told me just now, but.. you may benefit from reading Either - Or by Kierkegaard. |
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haha, I'm sorry for all the book recommendations.. I usually don't do that, but it's a sort of a compromise with myself over the "I want to explain, but I don't have the time or room for a treatise" problem. Anyway, you sound a bit like what Kierkegaard calls the aestethician (or something.. I'm reading the danish original, so I don't know what that translates as), who has the first part of that book and who is thoroughly criticised by the ethicist Assessor Wilhelm who has the second part of it. It's a huge book, though. |
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I think you care, and I think you want to persist and I think you want to enjoy life, music, etc. Otherwise you'd be somewhere near suicide by now. |
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no problem What's the criticism, in a nutshell? |
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i do and i am. |
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After a quick read of the wikipedia article (lolol) I don't seem to have the same conception of an aesthetic existence. My definition of aesthetics is much broader, I don't go through life trying to find beauty or cool things or whatever. I think absolutely everything I perceive should be judged, or rather criticised on an aesthetic level. Society is aesthetic, morality is aesthetic, my inner self is aesthetic. There's no end to this. I'm not passive; I'm responsible for my actions, but I'm always aware of their pointlessness. I live responsibly and gratuitously. |
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Yeah, that's why I wasn't sure.. that's part of the meaning of the title (at least that's how I see it): it isn't an either/or with this for the ethicist; the ethical stage retains the aestethical in a way, even though the aestethical may be found in other things/aspects or something. What I'm focusing on right now is keeping the aestethic analogous to a sort of individualism wherein one looks at oneself as a sort of awesomeness embodied, like you see in extreme-capitalist systems, and particularly in america, embodied in the "self-made-man" ideal ("I stand alone, the only true agent of truth") and the critique, that it isn't "either you're one of the masses, or you're alone" but rather that being one of the masses is possible while retaining your individuality (but it is possible to be lost in the masses, being nothing more than what one is). Or something. I'm drunk, hello, make me a bean-bag chair! |
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it is inevitable... we all end at some point. yet, we live on... in a never ending dream |
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what the hell..i cant stand this...can someone 'really' commit their entire being to the actual honest-to-god truth that they will die no matter what and NEVER EVER experience anything again. is it just me or does that seem like a stupid, goddamned sick joke. if someone actually seriously stopped parading around in all their masks, (the layers that protect/distract them from the truth) i'm pretty sure it would reveal that there's absolutely no option but to give into an immense anxiety/depression/insanity/murderous rage; especially near the point of death. though, of course since we're more stupid and ignorant creatures, we'd have a much less, more inhibited reaction than what a mighty god sentenced to that same fate would have. i assure that no one could dissect any thought enough to even begin to fathom what that damnation would feel like to a godly being that lead such a grand, long and illustrious life. because think of all the awesome stuff you will FOREVER miss in the future...(and try not to pin me down on a simple linear conception of future..ie. armageddon, or where things might turn out being shit anyways etc..)i'm supposing any worlds that the imagination could concieve of..specifically places that are beyond our perceptions, rich alien civilizations that have stood before time immemorial, in dimensions we haven't even begun to scratch the surface of. no getting to experience an orgasm X 100000, superpowers, and the knowledge that things will only continue getting better and better ad infinitum. ok. now to try and dispute that. might it be valid to propose that, since we have such a limited perception on time and space and everything like that, that even our concept of a non-existent eternity could be broken down into constituents until returning from a point of at least some kind of rudimentary movement, since it seems impossible to wrap our minds around the infinite things that could happen in the meantime during that non-existence, like time continuum stuff. ag |
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whops.. at very bottom i meant to say that i agree on a lot of what darius said. |
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what? |
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if you're going to die, why are you bothering to read this thread? why even bother to talk about it? why do anything? you are going to die anyway, so there's no point is there? |
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i'm not going to die. i'm going to live forever and ever |
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this is funny. Who the hell started this damn thread? I have one word for people suggesting that they shouldn't live their life the best way possible because they end up dead anyway: LOSER |
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you're going to die. |
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but you're going to die first. |
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Because it's fun, because why not, because it's interesting even in its gratuitousness. Your post is bad nihilism boo |
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there can be only one. |
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I think you have a beautiful view on existence, Fabien. |
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That question makes just as much sense if you say So I'm going to die, why don't I make the most out of it before I do so? Etc If it doesn't make sense, make sense out of it. |
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I think he has a fabulous ass. |
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"we are nihilists, lebowski! we believe in nothing, nothing! we will fuck you up, lebowski!" - Kraftwerk |
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Sure, you're going to be forgotten if you don't do anything in order to make people remember you. Not that it matters after your death anyway. I live in absurdity. Immigrating to a foreign country with different culture in my childhood made me look at reality and world from a different perspective. Perhaps it's one of the reasons I've been depressed for the last 6 years, but I still try to make some sense out of it. My idea is if you live your life, do everything in order to feel alive. Enjoy things, whether they're good or bad, because you won't get a second chance. Living in fear of death for your whole life (oh shit, a bus can hit me any moment), is literally dying already. The reality I had to face in this country at the start of the second intifada is that "you might die in a bus bombing, but does that mean you have to stop living?". So everyone took the chance and kept living. Some weren't lucky and actually died. But I don't think they care now anyway. In short: don't fear death, cause when it comes, you won't know fear any longer. |
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Why not make this thread a sticky? |
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"Enjoy things, whether they're good or bad" When something is bad that usually excludes the possibility of enjoying it. |
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that's why hope is for. even silly hopes, like hope for an afterlife (well, obviously a happy one, otherwise it would be fear rather than hope —at least it would for me—)... or uncertainty. as long as you're not 100% sure that death is the very end, thoughts like: "think of all the awesome stuff you will FOREVER miss in the future..." aren't relevant anymore since you would never know for sure whether you will miss them or not. also, "the knowledge that things will only continue getting better and better ad infinitum" : to me that's arguably just as utopic as eternal life. and even if you lived forever, unless you had infinite time travel or whatever, there would always be things you couldn't experience. an infinity of things. you can't be everywhere at the same time and do everything at the same time, so of course you'll miss out on things. you're bound to. now... i understand why it makes you mad. i'm sorry it does. i don't know why it doesn't for me; maybe i don't realize or something. |
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i'm over it |
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I am saddened by the recent deaths of those stalwarts of TV and Panto, John Inman, now free, and Gareth Hunt *does coffee bean shaking action as mark of respect* |
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But will you understand what is good, without bad? Contrast is needed in order to feel, therefore, feeling by itself should be enjoyed. Or at least the fact that you're here to feel. |
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Of course both good and bad is needed for either to exist; they're mutually dependent on each other, but I still doubt you're able to enjoy bad in anything but an abstract kind of way when what happened has faded into your memory as "only" what happened and something that "wasn't so bad after all" or if you look at the abstract categories and not particular and actual instances. |
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I guess you're right. I guess what I was trying to say in my first post here is that even if life's bad, you can almost always make it enjoyable in one way or another. The main idea was to not fear death though. |
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I kind of think it's healthy to fear death, as long as you don't go all apathetic or suicidal because of this fear or rather possibility of not existing. |
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Ok a new rewording: not to fixate on death. |
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Why not make this thread a sticky? |
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someday you will day somehow and something's gonna steal your carbon. |
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