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 (nobody)...and 413 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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Due to some changes in my household, I need to clear some space in our small home. I am thinking of getting ride of some of my bulkier old hardware and replace it with a single workstation. When I get together with the boys to make a racket, I currently use a Kawai k4r , a Q-80 Sequencer, an old Akai S01 sampler, two el-cheapo Behringer effects units, an Alesis HR-16B (might keep this), a distortion pedal, 3 cheap mikes and a 16 channel mixer. What I'd like to do is get rid of the rack-mounted gear and replace it all with a single unit. It needs to sequence, with midi outs (preferably two, so I can sync with my mates gear), have some-type of in-built synth (nothing flash, I'm used to the 16-bit sound of the K4), an in built sampler that I can preferably load .wavs into, on-board effects (again, nothing flash but the more the better) and multiple audio outs (at least 2 stereo outs) and audio in's (so I can route external audio through the onboard effects). The more natural and easier to use the interface is the better. We don't make great sounding music (think noisy, improv, simple beats, angry-acid with a human touch) so it dosn't need to be great sounding. New or second-hand, the cheaper the better at the moment. Any ideas? Cheers |
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ummm, no thanks......... what were you looking for when you found that? |
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no i was looking for that. |
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you must be very happy then :) |
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i'm not old enough to watch that. can someone please tell me what's in it? |
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A whole lot of loving...... :) Now, please, back on topic..... Workstations that will be suitable for me..... anyone? |
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wouldn't bother with a workstation, just get something like with and . |
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yeah, i've thought about the pc route......... it might be the most simple approach, but the guys I play with arn't really software people and we tend to swap around on each others gear as we play........... and i've always made "better" sounds on hardware (better is a relative term here, given that what I make hovers somewhere between horrible and awful).... i think "more satisfying" sounds is a more accurate term. Thanks for your suggestion though..... really appreciate it....... better than a large woman rubbing lotion on herself self(please see tradgedy's link above). |
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herself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself selfherself self |
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damn, not to be presumptuous or anything, but it looks like you hit the nail on the head with that one. |
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A Kurzweil 2000 might be another option too |
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K2000 that is |
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Wow, both of those suggestions look spot on. And not too expensive. The rackmount version of either with a small footprint midi input device could be very cool. Thanks dude, I think you've found the best value for money hardware answer. Now I just have to find one to ship to Oz. |
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i love happy endings |
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Now, what about the newer "groovebox" equipment? Are any modern manufacturers making the type of gear I am after? The above units have all of the technical requirements i would like, but the interface, particularly for the sequencer, might be an issue. The step-sequencer style of interface has always seemed quite simple to use. Anyone got any more ideas? |
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..............and the story continues (hopefully)! |
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I am trying to remember how the step sequencer on my ASR-X Pro works. I am pretty sure instead of a grid you have to put 1/4 or 1/8 and then hit the note. With that it was generally easier to record a pattern real time, then go back and use the step-sequencer and job/param functions to touch it up. I prefer grid-style step sequencing myself much more intuitive. I'm not too familiar with the Electribes, MPCs and those kind of boxes. I'm sure many of them offer grid style sequencing and some, but not all, include sampling. Prob have to just pull up some spec sheets, google some forums, and maybe just walk in a guitar center and see what they have on the floor to tinker around with. |
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But yea, with the ASR series you basically had a "sequence," which is like a performance or multi on other workstations and contains your 16 patches or kits, 2 insert FX and a global reverb (I can't remember if you had multiple patterns within a sequence or if your sequence was the pattern. I'm not at home so can't go check.) Then in song mode you would string those sequences together to form a song. The one thing there was that if you were running different FX on each sequence it would not transition seamlessly from one sequence to the next. You had to resample the pattern with the FX, assign the loop to a pad and then reprogram as a triggered loop. |
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I use a mpc 1000 with the unofficial JJOS which has a grid edit in it. I really like it. However no synth engine as such. There is a new mpc, the mpc5000, which does have a DSP synth inside it. It's pretty new, so I couldn't say if it's good, bad or ugly. If you have the money, get the mpc 4000. It's the flagship mpc for sure. It can do 24bit/96khz sampling and has grid edit and so much good stuff. It's quite big, but is a great box to have. No synth engine as such, but multisamples and decent programs mean who cares. (I use a rackmount S5000 sampler as a synth with good multisamples and apply envelopes,etc and its as good as a synth) An alternative, which a lot of people seem to like is the Roland MV8800. But I've never used one. So, I think mpc 1000, 2500 are good budget ones, then if you have the dosh get a mpc4000 or mpc5000 or mv8800. Personally if I had room/cash I would get the 4000, but I think they've stopped making them now(?) Hopefully this is the sort of thing you're after. |
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Thanks for the input...... I just spent some time looking at the MPC range on youtube. Either the MPC1000 or 2000 look good. I can live without a synth i have to. The only thing I would miss is the ability to process external audio through effects. The mpc5000 does this, but the cost is crazy! I like being able to transfer files via usb aswell. Maybe I can keep my effects rack and sell the rest..... food for thought. |
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You can process your external audio through the mpc1000's effects/ |
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ok, really? only a single stereo input yeah? and in real-time, as the thing is playing samples etc? and can you have separate fx for the external audio and the samples that are being played? |
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There are 3fx engines in the mpc1000. The first two are assignable and have a selection of effects, which you can use in a send/return chain using the internal programs or external inputs. The third is a "mastering" section, which provides 4 band semi parametric EQ and a compressor. You can use "input thru" to process the external stereo (or mono) signal. If you feed it out of the main stereo outs you can also send it to fx unit 1 or 2. If you use any other outputs you cannot do this. However for any setting you can also apply a low/band/hi pass filter to the external signal and also apply realtime pitch shifting. So, if you use fx 1 for the internal sounds and fx 2 for the external sounds you're sorted. Alternatively you could use fx 1 and 2 for internals and just use say the low pass filter and/or the pitch shifter on the external signals. You can also assign the Q link knobs for hands on knobby control of most parameters. |
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Thanks for the clarification. That sounds great. Very small footprint as well. I've seen some youtube footage of the MPC 1000, but unfortunately its mostly of wankers making bad R&B |
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If you do get the mpc1000, I would recommend the first thing you do is purchase the JJOS for it. This is a 3rd party OS. The new version JJOS2 is under development and not stable, but the JJOS1 is very stable, better than the akai OS both in terms of stability and also features. After using the JJOS I think why didn't akai do it this way! All I can say is just get it asap. No point getting into the plain old akai system when the JJOS1 is far superior. have a look here for more info http://www7a.biglobe.ne.jp/~mpc1000/ It's perhaps a bit overwhelming, but after a few hours on akai os you can appreciate things like global program edit and grid edit. The only problem with the mpc1000 was with the pads degrading. This is now fixed. It's a great little box. You could easily use it for a whole track. here are some good vids http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZTY8vlKO9hg http://youtube.com/watch?v=0uwN-d7LXTA&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4jAllTGFUM&feature=related |
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The alternate OS looks good, but the online manual is shocking Whats the difrerence between the blue modles and the black ones? Are the blue ones older one's, and therfore more likely to have pad problems? and can you fix the pad issue? Thanks for answering all my questions. |
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The blue ones were the original ones. I don't think you can get them now. Their model code is MPC1000. Black was the new colour, called MPC1000BK. The latest black ones should have the new good pads, these are called MPC1000BK-N. The barcode sticker underneath has one of these designators. Possibly the box too(?) I have the black one with the older "crap" pads, but I haven't experienced problems with them yet. There is a kit to make the old blue and black ones upto the latest and greatest standard by replacing the old pads. The problem with the pads was due to the frankly shocking decision on how to make them. The BK-N model uses the tried and tested method with all the pads on a single sheet. The older mpc1000s have seperate pads, which degrade over time due to stupid design. If you buy a new one now you should be ok. It's worth checking though, because the pad "upgrade" kit costs money! As for the JJOS instructions, they are shocking due to the translation from Japanese to English creating some sort of Jenglish dialect. there is lots of info on the mpc-forums.com website once you play around with it you won't have any problems. some features are a bit hidden, but you will think "it would be ace if I could do xyz" and then find that is a shift key and some button to do it or on some menu you've never really explorered. So in conclusion, get the MPC1000BK-N and get the JJOS. You can try the free 3.08 version or whatever it is and you get goodies like grid edit and global program edit, but this lacks a lot of other nice things. Oh and I suggest you get a RAM upgrade. The akai RAM is a ripoff. you just need to buy a 256mb laptop ram PC133 card I think and it will cost not a lot and you get 128mb to play with then. some info here http://mpc-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=26775 I think the CF cards can be upto 2gig in size and you can also use a hard disk if you want. I think the mpc2500 lets you install a CD burner too, but you might want to check that. |
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have you looked at the ? |
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Everyone wants a machinedrum but they are $$ |
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I don't want a machine drum. In the whole interface vs sound arena, they kill for interface, but they sound thin and digital. I can't see why I wouldn't just end up using a computer instead if I wanted my music to sound thin. If you want my advice, go to the music store and try out all the different machines they have for a few hours each, and don't buy something until you say to yourself "fuck I need this". If you can't find the device you are looking for post an add on craigslist asking for people that would be kind enough to let you try theirs. You will usually find a couple zealots that think that it would be worth their time just to convince another person to fall in love with their workhorse of choice. Everything is going to cost you at least $500 unless you get lucky. That kind of money isn't worth spending on advice you get online from people that have no idea of how your work flow functions or what you really need. |
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The machine drum is out of my price range. I'm going to have enough trouble keeping my wife happy with a 2nd hand MPC (not really, she's cool, but just at the moment blowing money on "toys" isn't a good idea). I am going to visit my local store in the next few weeks and have a play around with some gear........... |
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Do what I do. Buy it with a sheepish look on your face, and as soon as she says something negative about it snap at her and tell her its your money you are spending. Those conversations always seem to end with 'as long as you are happy' and then a kiss. Its kind of nice. |
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can you do step recording on an MPC 1000. . . like programming an alesis sr16 ? |
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Yeah, you can do realtime or programed. The one weak point of a mpc1k is that its a bit awkward to do the step sequencing. The JJ os fixes that. |
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and you can do this down to 96 resolution or higher? can you edit note velocities also? |
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I don't do "sheepish" or "snapping". She'll be right. If I sell the gear I have now and it costs $500 or less then it will be ok. She really is supportive of all of my hobbies. And I don't tell her what to spend her money on. We are financially independant of each other, although that will change in August. |
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That was meant to be a joke, but you should always have a serious discussion before making any large purchases like this. |
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:) |
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on the jj os i mean? =] |
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I don`t know from firsthand experience. I have this nasty little goblin on my shoulder that makes me too paranoid to install it as it may become an issue in the event I want it serviced by an authorized akai repairman. |
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fairplay. . . thanks=] |
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What you need is a quantum invertedly fluctuated despangulator. |
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I can't believe you haven't got the JJOS. I think akai would be shocked if your MPC didn't have it. There are so many people with it on the mpc-forums that you're in the minority (probably). The latest JJOS1 is so stable. It has less bugs than akai OS, more features and the bits that are the same that have been tweaked have been improved and made much more usable. akai program mode was pants. you could only tweak one pad at a time. JJOS global program edit you can grab whole bunches of pads and tweak them together. If you want to apply a filter to all or an envelope or whatever it is so much faster you just think "why the hell didn't akai do it this way from the get go?" You can edit velocities in akai and JJOS. in akai you have to use the step edit mode, In JJOS you can do this and grid edit. in grid edit you move your crosshairds over the note you want hit overdub to enter edit mode and press edit to tweak all the parameters. to do a whole load of notes you can do this in the SEQ EDIT screen and scroll to velocity and you can do scaling, add or subtract offsets, set them all to a certain value, etc etc You can also do transposing, shift timing, copy and move bits all sorts on this screen. Its the same for both OS's. The thing that JJOS can do that akai os can't is much better handling of midi. the killer feature is the midi grid edit lets you draw curves and things for say pitch bend or mod wheel, etc to drive external synth. you select area you want to curve over, use the two sliders to set start and stop levels and twist wheel to get a smooth curve or one with gaps, etc like the density control for the curve say. hard to explain but easy to figure out and appreciate. JJOS is just SO MUCH BETTER in so many ways. do yourself a favour and DOUBLE the usefulness of the box. |
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Having loaded the JJOS, you can't re-load the Akai OS, right? |
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You can re-install the akai os the same way you install the JJOS. It's dead easy. |
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Actually with the new version you get a choice as to which OS you want it to load on startup. I understand the benefits and all of it. Done a lot of research and after careful deliberation decided that it doesn't change the fact that loading third party operating systems will void any responsibility akai has with my machine. That's a bad thing. |
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Not quite correct there. The option to boot OS1 or OS2 lets you choose which JJOS to load. JJOS1 is the current stable one. JJOS2 is the new under development super dooper one, which adds lots of features found on "proper" samplers like full ADSR envelopes and tons of new exciting stuff. JJOS1 is compatible with legacy akai OS, but the new JJOS2 programs are slightly incompatible. When your warranty runs out you should install it because by that point whatever goes wrong you have to pay no matter what is installed. I'm glad you're happy with the akai os, but once you've taken a bite of the forbidden JJ fruit, there's no turning back! Seriously though, the day the warranty runs out at least stick the freebie 3.08 JJ on there. |
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I am too detatched from this website to know if there was any follow up to this. Anything happen? Happy/unhappy new owner of an mpc? I like to hear good stories. |
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