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It's the Americanisation/Globalisation of the world. Every industrialised nation is losing its identity and culture, and we're slowly becoming a homogenous global society. America is the world's richest country, and consequently everyone else is trying to emulate America - partly because they've "sold" their ideas to the rest of the world, and partly because the rest of their world is, rightly or wrongly, striving to follow an American economic model in the hope of attaining the same wealth and power. America has always sold bland, lifeless crap because it sells well and can be mass produced easily. Anything "different" that appeals to a niche won't sell so well. This applies to music (American pop, rock, etc), food (look at how boring and stale American beer is, McDonalds, etc). There's very little to like about these things, and very little to dislike. Anyone who truly appreciates good music, good beer, etc is going to think it's crap, but most other people just accept it because it's easy. Most people don't want to be challenged, or to experience new and interesting things - they just want what they trust: plain, sterile things. The manufacturers are therefore able to sell a lot of their products, and are able to produce them in huge bulk production runs (which work out much cheaper), and consequently make more profit. It's hideous. |
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You are kind of wrong there too. The music industry has always been concerned with profit. It wasn't so much dedicated to manufacturing stuff as it is now. |
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Ah, ok. Thanks. |
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*claps* : ) |
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well, punk rock, pop, early electronica, all those bands. it was a pretty massive thing back then, and most of them didn't give much thought into money..i don't know how many big records labels there were at that time..i would guess not many and they surely weren't interested in music like that. people still loved it though. something like that is impossible to happen nowdays because people suck, it's as easy as that. maybe if people in charge of music companies would understand music better, or had a better taste people would change too but it doesn't seem like that will happen any time soon.. |
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(most of) the large record labels that are around now were around back then and they were just as large comparatively. |
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agree on americanization being bad, but that most people don't like being challenged.. well.. you must not know many people... |
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"Most people don't want to be challenged, or to experience new and interesting things - they just want what they trust: plain, sterile things." that's the part that explains my thoughts real well. |
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then we can empirically state that you are wrong. |
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they were forming in those years, yes. and personally i wouldn't mind companies making million if they would still release music that wasn't as bland as it is nowdays. it's too obvious it's only about money nowdays and music doesn't even matter anymore. people who started those labels knew music better than the jerks runing them today..they're finances experts and probably can't tell difference between classic and rock music. |
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oh yeah? care to explain? |
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I'm with mortsto, I think, you grumpy old man. let's have some schoolboys instead. |
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Well, I love the glossy sheen of contempory pop and R'n'B. All the airbrushed sluts in the videos, the over the top portrayal of conspicuous consumption above everything else, the polished attempts at cheap emotion, the endlessly shifting fashions...all of this fascinates me. I think electronica artists could learn a lot from the pop industry, they would certainly sell more records. |
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well, at least with people I know, the largest portion of them are NOT into the list pop stuff.. actually, I don't know anyone who's over 16 who's into it (though the youngest person I know is 19). |
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excellent idea! |
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and how many people you see attending alternative gigs???????????????????????????????????????????????? |
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mmmmmm.. and in those tight outfits too! mmmmmmmmmmm |
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OK, if most people DO like to be challenged, why do most people buy crap music, drink Budweiser, eat fast food, follow fashions and watch reality TV? |
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place packed every time, so it depends on the place. there are enough people here to sell out just about anything, though most "pop" artists can't play at places where people serve alcohol as 90% of their listeners wouldn't be allowed in... |
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you're just thinking about it the wrong way. they are actually buying good music (well, the one about budweiser I don't get either), eat.. well.. fast food... they need food fast, dress nicely and enjoy television entertainment. |
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Who gives a fuck about the "alternative" anyway? Young musicians should be trying to find ways of bringing innovation into the mainstream, rather than moping around in some "underground" mindset. The artist who's impressed me the most over the last couple of years is probably Jamie Lidell. He's actually making an attempt to do something more exicting than making records that sound a bit like autechre. |
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"Young musicians should be trying to find ways of bringing innovation into the mainstream" THAT IS MY POINT. HOW CAN THEY DO THAT WHEN PEOPLE DON'T CARE ABOUT IT? let me guess, 100 people attend and it's packed. great! |
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Of course people like to hear innovation. But in a pop format. The problem is young musicians themselves, they either make godawful generic NME indie, and sell records, or fuck around on the underground in a tight little scene. We need more bands like Scritti Polliti or early Pulp. |
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i agree. except for the first sentence. people are fcuking stupid nowdays and that is a fact. |
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stupid back in the days too, just in another way. |
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i agree with the pop music beeing worse then ever. on the other side i don't think most people listen to the worst crap, like the shit on the top of the billboards. at least over here you only need to sell a very little amount of singles to top the list, and artists and labels are easily buying they're way to the top of the lists. the sad thing is that the mainstream radio channels gives air time based on the billboard lists. i think most people actually doesn't care much about music at all. the good thing is the internet. the trend i think is that people find their own style and take part of subcultures like xltronic |
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But people are probably more educated nowadays and have more access to information than ever before. It doesn't really figure that just because people have bland taste in music that they're "stupid". One of my friends is doing a PHD in artificial intelligence and likes the most mainstream music you could imagine. |
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mainstream radio channels gives air time based on the billboard lists. and the billboard lists are in turn affected by how many times you're played on radio. |
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one false thing in that argument: doing a phd != intelligent. |
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stupid music wise ofcourse. oyvinto, i wasn't thinking of stuff that's neccessarilly on charts, but most popular music nowdays..ofcourse there are always some exceptions. |
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do a mix of the stuff you think is good from "back then" and post it. |
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if you're not talking charts, but most popular, I have NO idea what you're on about, as the most popular stuff right now is the stuff that rock bands from mid 70s to the mid 80s released and stuff that sounds exactly like it. |
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I know what you mean, he is a pretty smart guy though. Just not into music. What do we mean by intelligence anyway? Being good at homework, IQ tests, on top of the bell jar etc, or having imagination, an inquiring mind, etc, |
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well, the good thing at least, is that it's easier to find your won style and take part of a subcuture you like, thanks to the internet. back in the days you were stuck with what you could get in the local shop or you had to move to manchester or something. |
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I don't think intelligence can be reduced to any of those; it's a quality of its own. |
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yeah definitely! mastah, stuff that is on pop chart, this revival thing you probably think of is shite compared to the original 80's stuff. |
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Well, I love the glossy sheen of contempory pop and R'n'B. All the airbrushed sluts in the videos, the over the top portrayal of conspicuous consumption above everything else, the polished attempts at cheap emotion, the endlessly shifting fashions...all of this fascinates me. I think electronica artists could learn a lot from the pop industry, they would certainly sell more records. |
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make up your mind. is it stuff that's on the pop charts, not stuff that's on the pop charts, rock, 80s music, pop, underground.. what?! schoolbuoy |
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popular stuff from 80's > popular stuff nowdays clear enough for you ljubezen? |
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as long as we phrase it "I prefer" and not "is better than," and actually mean it, I'm satisfied. I'm having a bad day anyway. |
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ha, but i will never agree to that as it just isn't true. sorry to hear about your bad day..im having a bad decade.. |
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I read decade as headache and was about to say that I've had one for three hours, but.. I just said it with no relevance. I should probably make dinner soon. |
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wtf, dinner at 4 pm? i just had my breakfast. |
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I didn't even have breakfast yet, though... |
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when you look at the 80's, it was one of the very best periods of modern music. there is just this plethora of important and revolutionary art from that period that is totally overlooked. why? because it wasn't part of mainstream culture. it had its own culture at that time. there was underground music - the self-established punk rock world, the localized art scenes in nyc and other places... but the end of the 80's was the expiration date for the vast majority of this stuff due to a variety of reasons. i don't think there's been a change in mainstream culture, though. it's been pretty much the same for the past thirty years. nothing's changed about it. it's always sucked and always will. the only sad thing here is that there is that underground music has no legs to make its own way anymore in terms of business - selling records and touring. bands nowadays can't make money doing what they could in the 80's. that tangible support network is a thing of the past. |
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I really think that bands lack imagination at the moment. The pop industry is just an easy target. |
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well i still think pop music in 80's was better but that isn't really what i was trying to say..drunkem mastah confused me with that schoolboys stuff. a lot more people appreciated different (good) music back in the 80's. i can't see that happen nowdays, everyone seems to be content with music big companies are forcing..they just don't care. |
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i don't think pop music has been at all enjoyable since like the 60's rock and roll shit. even then, most of that really sucked... what's so great about 80's pop music? it was the same as it is now, just that they had different cutting edge technology to make the same shitty pop songs. |
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you just have to look more carefully. |
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i must think about the other pop music.. |
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