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 (nobody)...and 604 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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Do you believe in Good and Evil ? Can you REALLY distinguish between Good and Evil, or does it ALWAYS depend on the person ? |
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i dont believe in Good and Evil, i believe in good and evil. |
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an |
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There are no absolutes........relativism rules...... therefore no good, no evil. |
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So, you wouldn't call Hitler an Evil person ? Maybe misguided, or delusional, but NOT evil? |
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there are evil people, there are good people, but you should probably find that out yourself and not take my word for it. |
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do you know hitler? enough to say that yes, he was evil - you should researve these words for people you know. |
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Thats right.... not Evil...... not misguided either, probably delusional, definitely damaging, destructive, deadly (all the d's!)........ Evil is a human construct |
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what do you mean human construct? we are humans we live in our constructs - what else is there? |
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He was a democraticlly elected leader. |
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? why is this important? |
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Metaphysic, god, Religion, etc |
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Im not trying to defend Hitler, Im trying to find a defenition for GOOD and EVIL |
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ok....i will give you my definition of evil - a person is evil or shows evilness when they willfully choose to do the morally incorrect thing - morality has to be put into the definition of evil because, it defines a standard or ethics. |
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The ideas of "Evil" and "Good" don't exist outside of the human experience....... whereas and idea or "thing" like "destruction" does, if you follow me........... |
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how can you define a standard of morality? what you may think is immoral, i may think as being ok......... |
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good would be....to willfully choose to make moral decisions. if you go through life, and in the back of your mind you are always looking to the moral side as the correct side, and you feel it as the correct side, you are good. |
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no i dont follow you - nothing exists outside of human experience - obviously there is matter and all of that, time and space and that - but everything is only given meaning by us therefore without us, or humans, nothing has meaning. |
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Every society has its on morality standards, that you could always criticize.... |
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but there is a standard or morality whether or not opinions differ - there is a goodness and a badness sense about actions - whether or not you view killing a person as the morally correct view - you are good in your eyes but evil in my eyes, the definitions still exist, but are different for you and me - i am not saying they are absolute. |
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Really? You think things only have meaning because of humans? What would happen if we were all wiped out? Would the universe end? what happenned before we had evolved? Nothing existed? What is this "meaning" you talk about? |
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they are not absolute though - like i said Good vs good, Evil vs evil |
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I guess I just disagree with you... I don't think there are goodness or badness feel to things that is universal......... |
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So therefore is it OKAY, to kill EVIL people ? |
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Hang on, the reads like shit......... I guess I disagree with you....... I don't believe that things have a universal good or bad sense to them..... |
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yes the universe, as far as we are concerned would end, how do you know it wouldnt end? you could never know this - the meaning of an ending is again, our definition of an ending, how do we know, in absolute terms, what would happen without us around? if the human experience would end - the definitions we place on our surroundings would end with us - these things might go on without us, but what meaning have they? nothing defines them - they are outside the boundaries of our experience. |
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50% and 50% |
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= vida |
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if you view that as a good or morally correct thing, and you want to always choose the morally correct thing - it is a morally correct decision for you to make - but as you decide to carry out your "good" decision -will every person see it as you do? no - hence good and evil are not absolute, but dependent upon the standard. |
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...these things might go on without us, but what meaning have they To evolve without us ? The fact that the dinosaurs died out is one great evidence that evolutionary theory is correct... |
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upon the standard - vida = Tridenti |
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You assume that experience ends when you die.......... you can never know that this is the case ;) The universe would not end if humans were wiped out dude....sorry, just wouldn't happen....... |
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If they are dependent on someones standard, therefore GOOD and EVIL do not exist. Just as Black and white are not colors |
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but the dinosaurs only came into our existence when we found their fossils - yes they were on this planet millions of years ago - but did it have any meaning to us before we found there fossils -no - for all we knew they did not exist - and infact they did not exist. evolution is another thread dude :) |
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they did exist....we just didn't know about them! we are not the center of the ubiverse.... we are not the reason the universe is here.... |
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you are thinking of ending in a big bangish destruction thing - i am thinking of it in a nothingness sense - when we die, nothing will have meaning - therefore it will cease to exist - now take the sun for example: its due to last millions or years, and will outlast us - but what will happens when that day comes - the human race will end - and so will the sun. now it wont burn out the day we die, but what meaning has the sun when the organism that give it meaning cease to exist - nothing, it will be nothing - it will cease to exist. |
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ubiverse...... you heard here first |
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you can imagine the dinosaurs millions of years ago - before us, or you can imagine the sun still being around when we die out - but it is impossible for it to exist when all of us die out - just like the dinosaurs did not have meaning when they existed, and only came into existence when we found them. its not that we are the center of the universe, only the universe and our surroundings are defined through us - they do not exist outside of our definitions. |
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no, it wont exist....... neither will humans at that point.... but the universe will exist... thngs that we are aware of now will exist........like black holes etc....... i know what you are saying -"with our minds the world we create" i just think you are taking the argument into places it dosn't hold true |
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well i am trying to show that meaning only comes through our language - the actualness of the universe even- take a rock - it has the name rock from us, it has its properties from us - everything about the rock is defines by humans. take the human out of the rock, and what are you left with? i am saying you are not left with anything. |
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The universe (or ubiverse) exists independant to human experience.......... thats the whole of my case. |
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how so then? give me your case, what properties of the universe will exist without human definitions? |
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I'm about to finish up at work, so lets agree to disagree! have a good weekend! |
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I'll get back to you when i log on at home |
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good discussion, take care |
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The RAW Substance, you are left with. Every object has an internal and external reality |
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mr monoid - both of those are defined by human intellect - like i am saying - the actual-ness or raw substance of a rock - or even math or physics does not matter after the beings who define it leave existence the raw substance is still defined by us - now will that rock exist? you could even lay the out the chemical compounds that make it us - what is it after we die or cease to exist? |
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us = up |
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Solipsism? |
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not truly - maybe more like the human mind (a theoreitcal whole) is the only thing that exists - it is the only thing that gives meaning. |
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