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no matter what he does part of (electronica) music fans is always displeased. the way i see it it's just impossible to satisfy everyone. those who don't like analord say he should do something more experimental, exploring sounds or something - but im sure if he'd do that other people would get displeased :) since the general audience and media prefers songs with this sort of complexion and structure he's been doing lately he's sticking with that i guess, and well, im sure he enjoys doing this more as well. im sure all of you who produce music know it's way easier to make something abstract rather than something in a form of a song like squarepusher and aphex (for example) are producing. so maybe the two of them can't really afford to go 'experimental', although i would love to see that happen as im sure he would do something above average as well :-) im hoping for something more abstract after this analord series, just so he will calm down all the people who are bashing him for being too pop or univentive :D |
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that's why a real productive human being--someone actually creating and contributing--follows their own vision, and checks back with reality to put things in perspective but is fundamentally acting for their own self. |
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what the fuk are they talkin about what else is there to explore? are you fucking kidding me? DO YOU REALLY THINK TERE IS SOME SORT OF HIDDEN SOUND OR SOME BREAKTHRU INCREDIBLE BEATS THAT NO ONE HAS ACCOMPLISHED TUHS FAR? JEEZOUS NO, IT'S OVER CIHLL THE FUK OUT and good night. but note: dood, there is no magical fuking "hidden experimental beat" that is going tobe discovered.. chill out and respect what your ears have the pleasure of listening to. enjoy |
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I like analord...it's good (very) but not the classic some people here are building it up to be. It is nice to hear Aphex returning somewhat to his roots, but I dunno, something about Analord just hasn't clicked for me yet. |
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There are always new sound and ways to structure them...sound is infinitely flexible, you just have to have the ability to utilize it in new ways. |
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Different tastes, fella. That's all there is to it. I'd agree to an extent about it being easier to produce "abstract" music, just as it's easier to produce "abstract" art. It's just as difficult getting it to sound pleasing to the ear though. |
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that's why I listened veeeeeeeeeeery carefully. This is not his roots. The instrumentation is grounded in his old favorites, but man the level of tweakage is way beyond drukqs. furthermore the structure is more like classical music than any electronica I have ever heard. |
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The progress of science depends on and exists thanks to the fundamental fallacy of your statements. |
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he didn't discover something new with analord. i agree completly on this. but he was never really the one breaking the ice imo - however he is the one that can produce the best certain 'genre' (be it ambient, acid, drill n bass,..) can offer though! and no one can make me think otherwise :) |
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I just listen to see if I like it, not the educationally examine it :P |
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personally i can't see anyone better in combining pleasant and unpleasant sounds so they become totally logical and awesome to the ear :) |
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sometimes breaking the ice is the easy part, and the real difficulty comes from properly utilizing new materials. Brahms was accused of being old-fashioned in his time, but holy fuck can almost no one in history stand up to him. |
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then of course if you don't examine it, you run the risk of making flawed statements, hence my outburst. |
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couldn't agree more there. that is why im an aphex twin fan boy. |
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"im sure all of you who produce music know it's way easier to make something abstract rather than something in a form of a song" I really don't agree. making an outstanding melody is fucking hard, but making a generally pleasing melody isn't. same goes for abstract crap - you can generate a lot of random noise, slightly restructure and it'll sound okay. but to make something abstract really good - ah! that's the cat's potatoes! |
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His reticence, for example, is no surprise for me at all, given what I know about his personality solely based on his music, and which I've mentioned above. |
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Why should I have to examine it? Also, he HAS returned to his roots regardless of your perceived technical appraisal of his tracks (have you ever considered he may just me making what he likes to listen to and has not applied any traditional music making theory what so ever?) |
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I'm not saying you should examine it. You said something about me examining it, and I merely stated that your arguments won't hold water if you don't do the same. You don't have to, but also don't expect to be solid. I said higher in this thread (the second post!) that he's making things as he wants, so yes I'm in agreement. and I'm stating that only in selection of instruments in a fundamental sense is the music in the roots.. and of course EVERYTHING is fundamentally in the roots, because he is the same person who wrote the shit years ago.. but the tweakage on the instruments is mad intensified, and of course the structure.. and holy shit why is no one mentioning that weird rhythmic fuckage? Never heard that in electronica (hemiola but NOT 2-3, all sorts of weird ones). |
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i don't think we will ever agree on this. personally i think aphex makes just as good melodies as autechre (they sound much better and more complex to my ear) you just need to give him a chance. i've tried with autechre many times because people always tell me how perfect their melodies are but i just can't hear some sort of complexity about them - i like quite a few of their songs, but even if i try to 'examine' (which takes all the fun away) their melodies i can't hear nothing too complex. |
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Concurrance from this alex, right here. |
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I have listened to both tracks quite a few times now, and I really do think you are reading more into them than is actually there. It's cool you love them so much though. |
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WHAAAAAAAAATTT?!??!!?!? qrter was implying autechre is the 'good melody' sort and aphex does the 'pleasing melody'? I certainly hope not, that's just brain dead. Autechre can barely ever come up with a melody, and it's usually just some simple pattern, often iterated. Aphex has super distinct melodic style, with all sorts of weird dissonances and rhythmic nuance, holy shit it's pleasing because it's fucking incredible. I REALLY hope that isn't what qrter is saying. |
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I think with ae it's all about the subtlety of how the melody fits with the more percussive/noise elements... i wouldn't say they have very complex melodies in the "bach four-zillion interwoven counterpoints" sense of the word. |
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qrter wasn't implying that but i've heard that from several people before. (wouldn't like to name them but im sure we'll get to hear from them soon :) |
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I'm partially pissy at what I consider to be many people's 'automatic' sort of reaction (I am not by any stretch implying this of you, you know I turbo respect your judgement). I listened to them thinking 'where the fuck is he coming from' and really searched, and have found all sorts of weird shit everywhere. furthermore, the fact that the shit totally slips my memory (and like I said, I can write down a melody after the first listen (this included not to brag but just for comparison)) indicates to me that something really weird is going on.. this is just an anecdote of course, but very irksome. |
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It's probably not, since there's no reference to either aphex or ae in that post. |
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not to mention i totally agree with that :) |
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Well I'm here with my guns, let's hope they show up. |
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GOOD |
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I'm glad about that and that we both like these tracks so much. I have only listened to classical music and analord since it came out, I feel like a faggot listening to other stuff (though I listened to some other aphex tracks just because, when I hear an old track in these, it's funny to compare closely). |
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well, personally i think analord is the most advanced aphex release to date. it has all the elements drukqs had only we get to hear some great new ideas on these two tracks. i wouldn't want this to become another afx vs ae thread, i just put autechre as example as they're considered to have the best melodies around here. |
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I'd like to add that in searching carefully you can almost always find something, so as you said lee, there's great likelihood that I'm fucking pulling shit out of my ass. In a sort of academic way I've enjoyed tearing them apart, and in a week or so (or maybe even longer!) this temporary nerd-high will subside and I'll be able to say if I REALLY like them, or if I'm just jacking off to all the weird fucked up genius shit he packed into there. |
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The reason I love listening to Aphex so much is because he is probably the only musician where he can do something I just wouldn't have expected. Autechre while very god are very predictable...there tracks are a whole. Excellent at times, but it's the track that stands out as a whole. Aphex has stand out tracks which in turn can have a dozen stand out moments, whether it is beat organisation, melodic change, whatever, he is just fucking awesome. There have ben times when I have listened and thought "you cheeky fucker you can't just do that" he makes what should be impossible to get right sound immaculate. |
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I didn't say Autechre are good at melody, no. in fact, most of their melodies suck awfully, BUT the few melodies of theirs I did like, I have liked a LOT. and I have also liked a few Aphex melodies, but most are dross to me. Autechre to me seem more interesting in the actual sounddesign used and the structuring of their tracks. a lot of Aphex' tracks have a kind of popsong structure that bores the tits off of off of me. and I do agree with other Alex, Autechre seem to be more into the whole package, how the melody is integrated into the whole thing. but this is all beside the point. Aphex can never win again simply because his name has become too big. I really think it's as simple as that. I don't get however, tolstoyed, how it is Aphex and/or Squarepuppy can't afford to go the experimental route? I think they don't want to, which is the best reason I could think of. and Aphex did a kind of experimental thing with the noise-tracks on "smojphace" which were hated by the melody-loving Aphex-fans and disliked by most people who normally listen to that kind of stuff (further proof that it really isn't that easy to make good abstract music). oh I don't know. sherry, anyone? |
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ahhahaha somehow I haven't heard people comment on their melodies, or rather never taken it as a general comment of greatness. Yeah I'm not going to say anything more, because I'll just start combusting all over the place. yeah I think the detail is wicked. I still can't get over xmd5a, how it has that initial section for a minute warming up, then the REAL first segment, then from 3:00-5:00 the next shit, and then it transitions similarly to at 3:00 again and goes into that fucked up last chunk. Fucking wicked bastard. |
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yeah this shit completely surprised me. also I like how he continued the joke of making his largest commitment to date (whhaattt?? 12 vinyl??!!) titled analord by having the first track (fenix funk) have the GAYEST start I have ever heard to any track ever. hahahahahaahhaa |
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P.S. I'm glad we're still talking about analord |
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smojphace was crap, and im sure you will agree even i could make better tracks than that, that is why im sure you'll agree that was just a showoff of his excentricism. i don't know why they can't afford it. i think they're 'experimental' enough you just have to put aside the popsong structure fact aside. imo again. sherry sounds nice :) |
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hehe...I'm still not a massive fan of fenix funk...it is a remix of vorhosbn...I am convinced. The first time I heard it I thought it was and that opinon still stands now. Both of these tracks would have fitted on Drukqs (they are better than most tracks off Drukqs) hence why I think a lot of people don't feel the progression as much. |
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are we? I'm not. |
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..which is why I think they just don't want to, which is fine. |
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im very glad to have finally someone who can enjoy/hear same stuff as i do and can explain it in better english :) |
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yo, go study the structure of xmd5a, or I email me to get a detailed analysis of it. I have never heard such intricate, potent structure outside of classical music. I'm not being a bigot here--that music simply had lots and lots of time and intellect put into each work. man have you heard melodies from mars? holy shit; all these little lines, interplaying with eachother brilliantly. please tell me a few autechre tracks that you feel have great melodies. I'm not saying I don't like any of their melodies, I'm just wondering what your picks are. |
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Thats a dilemma, not a paradox. A paradox would be if you told a genie "I wish my wish would not be granted." (taken from Godel Escher Bach). Personally, I think Richard does what he wants. He doesnt seem to care too much for pleasing his fans, I think he more enjoys teasing us. Analord was most definately a release for those of us who are rather obsessed with electronic music. I wouldnt have liked Analord if it weren't for the fact that I make music, and I was able to break down and analyse what he was doing. Although, I couldn't ever recreate it. I remember reading an interview with Richard, and he claimed that most of the tracks he likes the most, the fans wouldnt really like, so he usually gets his friends to choose tracks. I think Analord may have been a preview of some of his more unconventional tracks. |
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Have you got the Analord Vinyl and Binder now? |
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yeah I don't know about that one either. I think he might have 'just' been dicking around heavily when he created that track. I think it's good music, but not mad genius death. I am starting to think that xmd5a, however, is the fucking shit. |
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hahahaah I didn't buy it * runs like fucking hell * (*yells* I have no record player) |
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a paradox in a way he isn't 'allowed' to do someting more abstract :) and he should change his friends or not listen to their opinion. |
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yeah agreed; similar to my first post in this thread (#2 overall) |
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sneakattack. I listen to quite a bit of classical music, I'm very much into bach at the moment, but I do listen to a wide range of classical. I was recently introduced to the concept of canons and fugues, and I was just completely amazed. I agree with what your saying about elements of classical in Analord, although I have noticed some elements from classical music in his other works. Aphex knows what he is doing with music, he makes it both with his mind and his ears. Other people only seem to do it with one or the other. |
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