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I saw it for the first time last night. It's disturbing as shit. The actual footage from the shootings is something I would've rather not seen. Although Moore makes good points he's still a crank. I like his ideas, I just can't stand him. Definately worth seeing. |
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yep. it's a nice movie. |
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Yay! Another Bowling For Columbine topic! yay yay!! Let the fighting commence |
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i appologize |
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lol, my thoughts exactly :D |
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nah its awrite mate. Just gets people heated up thats all. A lotta fights. |
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I loved that movie. Being from Canade and seeing the movie in the States was interesting. I sat there in the theater laughing my ass off. |
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heh. bias bias bias... i dont enjoy statistics being thrown at me either... still, this movie owns :) |
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I'm from Canada, and I couldn't believe that something like this actually materialized. I'm surprised Micheal Moore wans't bumped off a couple of years ago but the US government. |
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ahah remember his yankies cap !!! Moore is stupid |
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i like the way it was filmed...appart from that it wasnt nothing much, actually not discovering something we didnt know before |
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i actually watched it again last night too. i liked it a lot. but, it's not really accurate to call it a 'documentary'. and just for good measure: |
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Remember that this messageboard consists of entirely different audience. Everyone here knows the US is crazy, but consider yourself a cup of water in an ocean. I think it was shocking to most Americans. They probably hate Moore for dissing their country, and Charlton Heston is going down! |
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Gee, I guess we should believe the angry little guy who cut up the documentary, rather than the documentary itself? WHO TO BELIEVE!!!! |
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it's not a documentary son. adapt your question to say "I guess we should believe the angry little guy who cut up the documentary, rather than the (for profit hollywood film) itself |
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imo: it's a very good film. it raises a lot of relavent, and important questions. and, it's not so radical that it will offend every gun totin' american out there. but, it does put it's own twist on the facts. and, it really isn't a documentary. it's a peice of creative propaganda... based loosly on fact. michael moore makes good movies, and i like him... but he is far from unbiased. |
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it's a documentary! what definition are you using for 'documentary'? |
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Fuck, when a documentary is trying to be persuasive it's going to include that which is persuasive and eliminate that which is not. I agree that its biased and deceptive. I'm having a hard time finding scientific fucking literature that isn't biased or poorly constructed these days. Sorry for all the swearing. |
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moore uses creative editing, and staged events to make points that aren't actually factual. things are shown out of sequence, facts are distorted, ect... he doesn't out and out lie in the film, but he does use enough creative license to break the true rules of documentary film making. read the article i posted for more clarification. |
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you might wanna be careful when throwing around that link. 'truth' is a matter of opinion for these people. they can bend everything to make it look like the truth. let them make a documentary like michael moore does instead of publishing a simple website. |
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so truth is a matter of opinion for some, but michael moore is beyond scrutiny? and what he says in a film should be blindy taken as fact? |
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just because a documentary uses elements of fiction does not make it less of a 'documentary'... I'm not sure there even is a definition for documentary, I mean an official one. Bill Nichols wrote "There is a specificity to documentary film and video that revolves around the phenomenon ov moving sounds and images recorded in media that allow for a remarkably high degree of fidelity between a representation and what it refers to". But I'm not sure there is so much more than that to it. There are no rules of objectivity. "Documentary" is about style, but it's also about the relationship between the filmmakers and the subjective. But a documentary does not garantuee anything... I hope you understand what I mean, and that I'm not way wrong here. |
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I love this mb. |
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these articles are a good bit more right-wing than i care to be, i just posted them to help show that the other article i posted wasn't the only one of it's kind. and, as i said before i like mr. moore, and i like every film of his that i've seen. but, i do think that he peiced things together in bowling for columbine in such a way that it gets away from the facts. and thus, looses it's true stature as a peice of documentary film. and no Key_Secret, i don't think you're way wrong. like i said, i don't think moore out and out lied, (like a few of the articles say) but he did manipulate the truth. |
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oh man for descriptions there are dictionaries! whats a documentary ????!!!! that hurts |
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What are the things that a film needs to "be" to be called a "documentary"? |
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and youre like never stopping |
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sorry... that is not the "official definition" for documentary, but what the Academy thinks a documentary needs to be to fit into the category... |
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daaaaddd there's a dragon acting smart in the garden !!! :'( |
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If I'm wrong; correct me. |
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he wants the war ! lol joking no but wheres the point really, youre fighting about whats a documentary...that doesnt mean a shit, and bowling is of course a documentary, its about the truth filmed with real people about a real subject. but yeah. its like youre fighting to know if the grass is red or green |
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if the academy of motion pictures doesn't decide what the official definition is, then who does? |
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they wont coz its already clear like source water |
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What makes their defintion official? |
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I feel like playing Bubble Bobble and I don't know why. |
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FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS |
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I would have to agree regarding the deception to a certain extent. I come from Toronto and Mr. Moore's presentation of a Canadian slum is a hell of a lot worse than what was portrayed in the film. That looks like my neighborhood for fuck sakes. |
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Yeah being Canadian and watching that movie was funny. I can't wait until the US takes over Canada and rapes us for our natural resources : ) We are way too laid back sometimes. |
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the dvd extra features are cool, he talks about the deeper meaning of the film and there's footage of a "return to littleton" where columbine survivors, parents, and just people from the area talk about how powerful and meaningful the film was to them... and elsewhere moore just talks a lot about taking action, as just a few people can make a big difference (which is so true) |
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When I first saw it a few weeks ago I loved it. It made me want to move to canada. My car gets broken into once a month here and nothing is stolen, but my car is looking pretty fucked. I live in a niced nieghborhood too. Canada is the place to be, it's generally boring, and a lot less psycho's. |
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I first saw the movie and I was really blown away, more so by the imagry and the way it was all done up, i dont like micheal moore that much personally, the movie was great and he did a good job |
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smoke weed every day |
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I lost a ton of respect for both the film and Mr. Moore's eithics when I learned of his distortions of the truth in Bowling for Columbine. However, I still respect his earlier effort, Roger & Me, which is an excellent film. |
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you learned nothing. a similar article could be written about roger & me, or for that matter, anything at all. it's really not that hard to write a scathing criticism of something subjective (ie: an opinionated documentary) providing no solid evidence for your claims. it's sure a lot easier to do that than to actually invest time, effort, and soul searching into something powerful like michael moore consistently does. |
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spot on |
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again we can simply default to the fact that it was a film made for entertainment purposes, and only to entertain to make money. It was a movie, not a study, not a scientific anything. It was entertainment. As we have said before here, you watch, if you enjoyed the points it brought up and laughed at parts, great, then you got your $10 worth. The more buzz it creates, the more people see it, and the more studio execs are going to greenlight more films that strike a similar chord. It's just a movie, you can not expect truth, and you can not deride it as all lies. |
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"entertain to make money"? man you really miss the plot. do you pay any attention to the subject matter? regarding the "entertainment" factor: as i've said in a previous, recent topic, WATCH THE DVD. moore says first and foremost that he wanted to make a film that he would go to see on a friday night. something entertaining. after THAT comes all his research. he pooled his funniest material into his movie instead of text, which is usually more factual (though still incredibly opinionated and comedic). |
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my point was not so much the money making attributes of greenlighting such a film, but more so the fact that it is a piece of entertainment. Nothing makes good buzz like good contreversey. In that case, this much buzz is good business. Entertainment and money go hand in hand throughout the conception, production and completion of any widly distributed feature film. --------- all said, this is what needs to be considered when talking abou the factual aspects of this movie, as opposed to saying it was a great piece of comedy satire. |
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"Micheal Moore will go on a hunger strike ... no one will notice for the first 15 years..." "In the year 2000, in the year 2000!" |
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