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 Now online (3)Roger Wilco Monoid big ...and 126 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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police has begun to remove 400 activists from the evacuated village Lützerath in the biggest lignite mine in europe. i dont know if you have ever seen something like this mining site. its like the grand canyon if you pass it by car. around it there still are some villages that will be eaten by the village after village had to be removed for the digging site. now, i do think its better to remove our own villages instead of those of indigenous people around the world, but considering we hardly need the brown coal any more. we definitely dont need it any more to burn in power plants as there are plenty of good alternatives, the government and the big power company made a deal to dig up the rest, which will result in blasting up 280 million tons of co2 into the atmosphere to save a bit of money, saving the profits of a company that could have switched to alternatives long time ago and dont care about the climate pact of paris or the result in general. activists have successfully saved a large and old forest before. one journalist died in the battle for it. now they fortified themselves in the remains of said village. |
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what sort of mad bastard would try and excavate wheels? |
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two very different approaches to engineering, there |
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isengard is one of my fav names for the region i live in ^^ surely is fitting like no other. while we still have large city size areas, we make steel in, many former sites and cavities have already become lakes, many warehouses recreational and cultural facilities, blast furnaces museums. and i like that we did it in our area and not destroyed some other place for it. we still need some steel, we just have to stop burning coal for energy. asap. |
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hmm, archeologists?! maybe if we placed some rare fossil at the site they´d stop digging for a while... you know a neanderthal holding a speak and spell or sumpin. |
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no, sarumon and the other one. |
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don't worry, we're making new relics for a different civilization to dig up later. anyways, your initial post was long, and the video you posted -- rather serene, really. just a machine moving some sand. birds singing. i don't know what the fuck lignite is. but mostly activists have successfully saved a large and old forest before. one journalist died in the battle for it. now they fortified themselves in the remains of said village. this is where i will temporarily become judi dench from Casino Royale (2006): we're trying to find out how an entire network of eco-pillagers operate, and you give us one forest. hardly the big picture, wouldn't you say? that the real problem is BT or Exxon or whatever Shell company provides laudable deniability, they've priced this in already, you know that right? they've allocated some of their budget and schedule to: "oh, these people. it will take anywhere from 1-N days and we've planned for this" and, hey, guess what? you're just arguing with a bunch of laborers who are trying to make a buck, and a bunch of local thugs, both of which may actually be your buddies. and the problem is you waited until it showed up in your forest rather than stopping your government from cutting these deals, and now it's too late. and you might save a forest, maybe even for more than a few days, but... phyrric victory. better than those twits gluing themself to art with soup or whatever, i suppose. golf clap |
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also, sorry about the wheel misunderstanding we had in my first reply. glad we steered that up |
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no, wait, that's not bad. we wanted to question him, not to kill him and later any thug can kill and if we're treating this as a mirror of sorts, any idiot hippie can die for a forest and i don't mean to be insensitive; quite the opposite -- i think you can squeeze a lot more out of it if you're ready to make that level of sacrifice, perhaps without even having to actually do it. the original self-immolation display, saigon, was actually very calculated to maximize PR. like: if i'm burning myself, i'm going to get my freaking nickel's worth. dying for a single forest feels more like an understandable but horribly misguided attempt to give one's life meaning. please climb up a few rungs and kick exxon in the balls instead. even if their branding is handsome; the tiger pumps far sharper than any other chains i must say |
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i want you to take your ego out of the situation. to judge the situation dispassionately e.g. complete opposite end of the spectrum from |
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eqo out of the eguation eco out of the asian? i'm throwing this word tangent out now. |
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but yeah, a lot of these intense climate standoffs, it really seems about the protestors personal ego and attempt to escape the drudgery of their own existence rather than a sharp and organized movement to confront those actually responsible via, i'd suggest, the same tactics: PR campaigns; hostile land buyouts. get a few millionaires together and strategically buy parcels of land to make their life a legal nightmare. sue them over and over. use the proceeds to buy more land. buy a suit instead of laying down in front of a bulldozer. c'mon people |
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On the otherhand it has been pointed out by both Thich Nhat Hnah and Russell McCutcheon that by contextualizing the event in 1963 Vietnam, the self-immolation can be seen as a "political act" aimed at calling attention to the injustices being perpetrated against the South Vietnamese people by a puppet government of Euro-American imperialism. In this context, Thich Nhat Hnah describes the act of self-immolation as follows: "The press spoke then of suicide, but in the essence, it is not. It is not even a protest. What the monks said in the letters they left before burning themselves aimed only at alarming, at moving the hearts of the oppressors, and at calling the attention of the world to the suffering endured then by the Vietnamese. To burn oneself by fire is to prove that what one is saying is of the utmost importance…. The Vietnamese monk, by burning himself, says with all his strength and determination that he can endure the greatest of sufferings to protect his people…. To express will by burning oneself, therefore, is not to commit an act of destruction but to perform an act of construction, that is, to suffer and to die for the sake of one’s people. This is not suicide." Thich Nhat Hanh goes on to explaing why Thich Quang Duc’s self-immolation was not a suicide, which is contrary to Buddhist teachings: "Suicide is an act of self-destruction, having as causes the following: (1) lack of courage to live and to cope with difficulties; (2) defeat by life and loss of all hope; (3) desire for nonexistence….. The monk who burns himself has lost neither courage nor hope; nor does he desire nonexistence. On the contrary, he is very courageous and hopeful and aspires for something good in the future." showing up with wheels; having a plan. dark echoes of a "happening" for sure |
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but i still think you'd be best off creating something like a non-profit that functions like a private capital acquisition machine; strategically search the globe for cheap specks of land to purchase, that will grant ye a solid berth to annoy and/or sue the fossil fuel bastards; extract more money for more land. the way humans are, however, this would eventually be valuable enough that some asshole would attempt to take it over; you'd need to have it bury its tracks somehow... whatever. i'm more concerned about rent |
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...and on risking your life, if you were good enough at my proposed plan, someone would attempt to put hemlock in your OJ at some point. |
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continued rambles in can hippies scale that you don't want to merely be buying cheap specks of hidden gem for merely an angle on suing corporate giants for more cash. you want to get an eclectic but charming group of grad students to live in this shit house, and their rent is to start a youtube channel trying to do something like homebrew the heat pump system you didn't pay to put in, in an eco-friendly way. if you don't know about it, this will sound weird, but: this would actually be a very nice gift to grad students; many would be happy to land it. rent is just a tinker project and a youtube channel for the project's promotion. maybe they'll even invent something. but whatever. now you are, at the very least 1) satellite media presence, maybe even some cashflow somehow 2) justifiable reason for being at the house to slap down "you're just legal trolling arguments" 3) people there are down will all this nonsense anyways this is actually a lot like me thinking about how to map my synthesizers around a track. i should probably stop on this; stick to that. |
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Those local thugs as you call them are one of the biggest co2 sources in europe, one of the top 3 power firms in germany and blocking a decentralized change in energy supplies. Protest has been going on for years if not decades. Average joe just doesnt give a shit about climate change and the grave we dig ourselves. So yes the remains of a tiny forest itself is insignificant. So is a few tiny villages. I can see how their protest is easy to play down. Even to make fun of. But People are fighting for more than that. Anyone who doesnt see that is just closing their eyes. Arguing there is bigger fish is firstly not true. It would be quite a catch. and it is right here around my corner. In an overall helpless situation victories here would make others elsewhere more likely. And secondly: if you don't stand up for something you ll fall for anything. |
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What about the egos of a big ceo? Im sure all they think about is the greater good. Anyway motivation of activists is irrelevant. Dont put the people in focus. |
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Lignite is brown coal. I looked it up and thought this was the correct term and i thought the excavator was good clickbait. Its a fucking beast and i love it, seeing that puny human alongside the time i linked.but yeah i was in a hurry before work. |
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So, yesterday i went to the protest in Lützerath. According to the news more than 10.000 people showed up to express their dislike for our politics, to protest against unnecessary co2 pollution and climate change. Other sources and a regular stadium attender estimated it could have easily been 30.000 protesters. all i can say is, that it was a loooot of people, who still managed to come to a remote place, despite a rather displeasent rain storm blasting us and turning the whole site into a massive mudhole. it was great. |
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awesome you went Greta was there as well :) |
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yes, im glad i put up with the travel. thunberg is a good speaker. easy to understand, knew how to use a micro and she put the essentials in focus instead of some other guy who talked nonsense like co2 is racism and called to violence. well, as an audience you still can show what you approve of and what not. police upped the numbers to more than 15.000. |
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without knowing the details, i suspect the other guy talked nonsense, to me, at least. hard to compete with Greta, though: she's brilliant. well, and she's pointed out the common ground between climate change and colonialism, too |
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i don't suspect the other guy talked nonsense |
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yeah he was certainly right in terms of climate injustice, but calling it racism is not correct. money knows no color. so i more or less disagreed with terminology here. i didnt agree his call to storm the place and his call to violence. I see the urgency for change, while millions are dying in the global south, but i dont approve of violence. and in my eyes that is a very counter productive thing. some radicals apparently used fireworks on the police they said and they probably did. i heard some bangs and saw some smoke thats certain. but i cant say for sure as i wasnt close up at the gates of hell. the thing is: this new years eve germany had a bigger incident with idiots attacking police and firemen with fireworks, which caused a huge debate around new police measurements already and it is plain stupid ruining a good protest with this. Half of the news picked it up and many of the reports put violence in the focus. i dont think this is helping. |
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to clarify, calling someone, who doesnt give a shit about climate, a racist is misleading. and afaiac an accusation like that will end up in people defending themselves or disagreeing altogether. sadly, the ongoing climate injustice already, is too abstract for most people. he nicely pointed out that we should cut the global souths debts as germany was relieved of its debts after ww2. |
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let's focus on |
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oh cool it was actually a village |
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sounds like it was a wheel success? |
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yeah it was, they dismantled the last remaining squatted buildings and farm houses. the activists built a small community and actually lived there to keep the energy company from digging. when the clearance was about to start, a lot of them went into a large number treehouses and hid behinf barricades to stall the evacuation. effectively that is what caused the attention to the company firing up about triple the amount germany is allowed to blast into the atmosphere by the paris agreement, which i guess should be binding too right? best part for me was, when a couple of days before the evacuation the company put up fences somewhere around the larger area, which activists then stole to further fortify themselves. class! |
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haha, id say so. |
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behold!! haha, love it. i saw another video that had some clumsy music playing ^^ |
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this is not quite yet my idea of, essentially, building an endowment. buying up actual property and building a hut in the way of a gas pipeline. suing massively and growing your endowment but they're in the direction |
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owning property typically gives you a vast firehose of legal avenues you wouldn't have next country over, really. strategically acquiring really small, really annoying bits of land... this is how you can waltz into rural alaska or some shit and stop a pipeline from halfway around the world. or so i feel |
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then the warning, i guess: if this works, you are creating an increasingly massive pool of money and held property whose gradual increase is being architected by lawyers, and be careful how you set this up because it'll become a target just for the riches even without worrying about big oil. greta seems like an obvious choice. she'd have my vote simply because, like, not only does she seem solid, but don't think people would argue about the choice |
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to run that, i mean. |
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gonna look into that and other thred, quite busy these days looks interesting, havent gotten much into this yet |
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perhaps i'm a hacker that secretly wants a law degree. saw the article [posted above] show up a day or two ago; thot: it's always nice when someone actually does my thing. as ronald raygun said, there's no limit to what you can accomplish if you don't care who gets credit. i'm not like this for all my ideas, thanks, but this is like -- if greta is running it what'd i do but propose a good architecture, anyways? and i don't think i have the stomach to get shot at by oil snipers. have it. then the other thread, however, the city of industry thing -- that was honestly pure serendipity. i made that thread slightly before i read that article. then i'm just... playing out the thread, HA! what a punny. and i start actually seriously analyzing what it is, and... oh, interesting. i think i'm really onto something here. not simply, "you should smugly steal their game plan because why not" but "holy crap has anyone even sat down and taken a moment to analyze city of industry like this before?" and oh, gosh, that's fun. there's a lot in here but in the end, it is, actually... i was going on about, like "oh you're doing it wrong" months ago in this thread. and i mouth off about how to do it better. and so now i'm back with, i guess: "you see? someone else is doing some of this already. and i don't want to be a jerk i'm just upset you're doing it wrong" |
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look, me interviewing a guy from Germany, at a Dutch Ende Gelande like action |
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