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 Now online (2)belb recycle ...and 405 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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The second link is amazing! Please read page six & page 7 "Wikileaks.org claims to have developed an uncensorable version of the publicly available Wikipedia interface" basically the u.s army admits to censoring wikipedia "Wikileaks.org uses its own coded software combined with Wiki,MediaWiki,OpenSSL, FreeNet, TOR, and PGP to make it difficult for foreign governments, FISS, law enforcement agencies, and foreign businesses to determine where a leaked document originated from and who was responsible for leaking the document" basically the u.s army admits to hacking websites they dont like "Wikileaks.org claims that any attempt at trace routing of IP addresses, MAC addresses, and other identifying information of a home computer submissions (as opposed to cyber café submissions) through Wikileaks.org‘s Internet submission system would require a knowledge of information available only to Wikileaks.org programmers and to a rights organization serving the electronic community, or would require specialized ubiquitous traffic analysis of Internet messages and routing systems. Nevertheless, it remains technically feasible for FISS, law enforcement organizations, and foreign businesses that have the motivation, intentions, capability, and opportunity to gain online access or physical access to Wikileaks.org information systems to identify and trace whistleblowers through cyber investigations, advanced cyber tools, and forensics" essentially the u.s army admits to tapping peoples home computers |
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great read. |
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also, amazing video on the front page. when the ban drives in "those are not kids waving their hands, those are RPGs!" "roger" those people shooting down from the sky should get their eyes checked. |
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thanks for posting. Pretty fucked up. |
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time for a new world order of a pleasant kind. |
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"those people shooting down from the sky should get their eyes checked. " they were not necessarily looking through the same optics/monitor that is shown in the video (at that time). and you are watching this from the comfort of your computer and not in a stressful/tense moment ... hence you are relaxed, and everything was pointed out for you in the video (highlighted) ... so based upon that you see/know the truth in hindsight/context. whereas these gents did not; war is ugly. the camera man should not have been hanging around people with AKs and RPGs, period. that was also during a time of rampant RPG attacks...so the pilots were probably under a bit more stress than you sitting at your keyboard attempting to give your analysis of the situation. |
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FUCK YOU ELUSIVE |
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that's all pretty apparent. i dont think anybody here is overly stressed. its nice to actually know about what's happening. you should have put that post in the youtube comment section, it would have applied better. |
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i meant *i dont think anybody here is really trying demonize the soldiers involved. and i agree that the journalist should have taken better precaution. |
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But did they actually have weapons? I've read that it was all tripods and cameras and stuff. Plus did they really have to shoot some unarmed guy putting badly wounded people in his van? |
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I could see two men carrying weapons and 2 men carrying camera equipment |
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wat |
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@elusive of course they were not watching this in the shitty quality of a youtube video. what were they looking at if they were not watching the monitors? pictures of naked women? "oh for god sake kyle" *kyle cums* "haha, sorry" thats how stressed they were, mate. "its their fault for bringing kids to a combat" oh my god they must sleep like babies at night. - this guys in the ground had no weapons. you think they would be standing in a circle in the middle of the street holding RPGs? also, why shoot the van? really. they were just picking a wounded guy. they were not holding their AKs shooting to the air screaming "Alah!!" but "kyle" at this point is proly thinking "oh fuck they, are taking him away... Im sure they are going to give this fucker medical care, and Im so far away from my girl friend, or any real pussy for that matter" so yeah, basically, fuck you elusive. |
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if you want to lecture me on the weapons systems of the ah-64, then you got some serious street credit to build. they found expelled rpg and weapons. the journalists were hanging around guys with weapons. period. it was during a heightened period of combat with heavy RPG use throughout ... you are making your conclusion from the luxury of sitting in your chair at home..where everything was drawn out for you in the video...making it obvious what and where mistakes were made. also, by watching from the luxury of your home, the emotions of live combat are removed ... and you make decisions/draw conclusions in an entirely different manner - especially since your life isn't in direct danger. in time of combat, things are a little different. you are at a heightened sense of alertness, and reaction time / threat analysis can be compromised. if you were stuck in war time with your buddies getting KIA/MIA around you, and during a heightened period of RPG use ... you might release stress in ways you might look back on in disgust. that is war and it is ugly. realize this. sometimes a human has to get in that mindset by saying things like "fucking prick" to be able to kill. if you cannot understand this, then thank god you haven't been put in that position in your lifetime. sometimes shit is said out loud to convince oneself that what they just did isn't as big of a deal...this is for mental stabalization. just because the language disgusts you from the few minutes of this video doesn't mean the gunner isn't necessarily like that in real life...dont be so quick to judge. it's easy to point things out when there are little pointers and you can rewind and scrutinize on the video. things are a little bit different in the height of combat and things are live. realize this. |
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ah, here is a good read |
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everyone in the military should eat balls. if you put yourself in a position were you might have to kill people you dont even know, you are a prick. period. is this clear enough? If they cant tell those are fucking kids, then how can they tell an RPG from a cows leg? "that mutant cow is armed to the teeth kyle! shoot it, shoot it! oh fuck this is stressful there are armed cows everywhere" What I really mean is this: if they dont know what they are shooting at (because they dont have the right tecnology or just because they are plain idiots in a can in the sky) they shouldnt be shooting at all. (and as far as I know everyone in the military is a fucking idiot so all the shooting should be done by civilians) huzzah |
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oh and I dont think this guys are "evil" I just think they are dumbasses and actually feel sorry for them. |
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no, you've just never been in a combat scenario - so you don't really have room to talk. nor, from your language, do i think you've ever been in the professional workforce, either. |
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so, only veterans can talk about this shit? you are not my boss, so I can talk to you however I see fit. |
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so, let's get back on topic then - can you start lecturing my on the weapon systems of this particular ah-64? |
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I could google it. but who cares? really. Its not about what weapons they had on their flying can, its about how they used them. All I know is they shooted whatever weapons they had on "hostile" people thata hadent even noticed first, and then over a van that was trying to help a wounded man. lets put it like this: what is the "ah-64" had been shot down by and RPG and then the "rebels" would have shot medics trying to assist the wounded in the back? you would be thinking "bastards, paki bastards" |
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how come they didn't notice the chopper? or take cover? |
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come on people now---SMILE on your brother, EVERYBODY get together, try to LOVE one another RIGHT NOW! |
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elusive, were/are you in the military? |
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negatory. i have depth knowledge on these topics, however. career level stuff/engineering level weapon systems/protocols/etc. and of course know the people to engage on how things work "in the real world" the cover-up is what everyone should be upset about. not what spews from the gunner's mouth |
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"the cover-up is what everyone should be upset about" that's what i was upset about. Even my original assumption that they killed innocent civilians for no reason wasn't misplaced with any amount of higher morality. I have family that are in the army, and i was thinking about joining after college. kei9, if you're an American, you're speaking out of your ass. If you're some hypocritical Euro, then by all means go spout off, Euros aren't worth the dialogue. |
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you are not getting the point, I think. I dont care what he says, as long as he is not killing children. you care more about "the words used" than I do "nor, from your language, do i think you've ever been in the professional workforce, either." who cares what they said? kyle might have been saying "I want to stab those fuckers down there, stab em in the ass with my big thick cock and then set them on fire" and I wouldnt care, in fact Id "lold" if he had said that insted of killing them for no reason. I mean, those people were obviusly not in an agressive situation. although Im sure they knew of this "shoot anything with something hanging from its shoulder" algorithm this thugs seem to have been instructed to use to determine what to open fire on next, and could have been more careful. rad smiles is rite, we should hug and kiss, you can show me all those fancy weapons after he have sex, Ill go "wow" |
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how do you actually know just because the video started where it did that the situation wasn't previously escalated before the video started recording? |
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@pulseclock Im writing from argentina, thats south america. if you enlist they might send you down here at some point, to kill me because I was born in the country of el che. ring me up, Ill buy you a beer. cheers. |
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I don't think we have a war currently in argentina. So i think you're good. The only reason i'd want to enlist is because of money, i have no desire to kill anybody. |
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they were standing in a circle, man. do you see that? they were not ducking behind debris. As far as we know they might have been chating about hot american women on the tv when they got shot. |
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make your money in some other way. please. try not to put yourself in the situation were you might have to shoot somebody for no good reason other than just being told to. |
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So standing in a circle means they are pro-American? If it were me, and i saw a helicopter circling me and the people i was with, i would not stand around circle and wait for the helicopter to just keep on flying. Innocent or not, those people were just in the wrong place. |
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"this knob. turn right. full." |
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I'm well aware of what i'd be doing, i agree that a lot of soldiers are being falsely led, either by their superiors, or the american agenda in general, that's why joining after college would be better because you'd go through OCS to be an officer and as i understand there's a lot more options available, like not having to serve in the infantry. I'm sorry that i'd have to leanr how to defend myself from danger, but i'd feel like that risk is worth it when my country i was born in provides people with good lives. |
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they should shoot anyone who isnt pro-american? maybe that helicopter is in the wrong place actually, have you thought about that? anyways no one is huging nor kissing me so Im off for a while now. cheers. |
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You're trying to be ontological in a matter-of-fact discussion. It's just not gonna work, the deed is done, no use to try and justify it or reason out why it was wrong for the simple fact that you aren't any of the individuals involved. Maybe if you weren't someone from an electronic music messageboard i would be inclined to get all philosophical about something like this and go into the corruption which is allowing this kind of thing to happen in the first place. |
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"That knob. Turn right, full." |
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were you at Flying Lotus on the 1st? |
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elusive still hasn't responded to the fact that they proceeded to obliterate a van and obviously unarmed people who were trying to help the dying reuters man. a popular counterargument to this bandied about is that they have to do this, because people will otherwise get there, remove all of the arms for later use, and take photos of bodies lying on the ground, unarmed, painting the Americans as merciless killers of civilians. I find this pretty odd: Kill innocent, unarmed people, in order to prevent them from putting out propaganda that tricks people into thinking that the Americans kill innocent, unarmed people. Also, elusive, get off your fucking high horse. Talking down to people, basically telling them that they can come back and debate war and politics with you once they've learned as much as you know about weapons of killing makes you come off sounding not just like a complete arsehole, but one of those creepy gun-nut loons that everyone hates. |
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Did they know that he was a Reuters reporter? The only reason people think Americans are merciless killers is because people like you who have no idea what they're talking about. "Talking down to people, basically telling them that they can come back and debate war and politics with you once they've learned as much as you know about weapons of killing makes you come off sounding not just like a complete arsehole, but one of those creepy gun-nut loons that everyone hates. " No actually it makes people either get offended like you, or go and read and to prevent these emotional outbursts which are unhinged. |
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Thank god you're informed enough about Europeans to write them all off as hypocrites. |
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notice i said, "hypocritical Euros," not "Euros" and yes that wasn't thought out well. I'm all too human too. Maybe more vocal than i'd like to be. |
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you're a great man and a great thinker |
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killing/war is bad |
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@pulsecok: " the deed is done, no use to try and justify it or reason out why it was wrong for the simple fact that you aren't any of the individuals involved" ...really? there's no use in trying to reason why our troops murder unarmed men chilling on a street from hundreds of yards away up in the sky in an armored helicopter with state-of-the-art weapons systems? who would you leave the reasoning and justifying to? opaque military officials safe in offices lining their pockets with blood$$$? |
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haha wavephace, thats a nice avatar for such a name. kudos |
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what are you going to do about it by discussing the morality behind it? |
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@pusclock—"what are you going to do about it by discussing the morality behind it?" maybe have an understanding of why MEANS maybe shouldn't justify ENDS, why there is an endless supply of iraqis willing to risk their lives to chase out US troops wielding chickenshit aerial weapons.. checkit: "Dartmouth is all about contrived problems, nothing real. The “case study” method is big there, part of a system which deludes its followers into thinking that application can be learned by simulation. A little of that doesn’t hurt, but a lot is worse than worthless: it fills you with false confidence that complex problems are fully amenable to method —like repairing machinery is— but when you try to fit human beings into the abstract simplifications of method you discover they have to be forced to obey the theory. And sometimes they force back. Iraq, Afghanistan, Sudan, all gifts of think-tank methodology, and all impervious to solution by method." -weapons of mass distraction, john taylor gatto killing these unarmed men on the street is not going to end our war in iraq.. |
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Goodnight. |
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