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 (nobody)...and 255 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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Musical education, is it necessary to make music? Are most artist you know educated in music? Is it posible to learn music by just using intuition, and playing with sounds? Technical knowlage (hardware/software) vs knowlage about music which is more important for you and why? Do you feel pleased with music which you make? Is it talent or hard work to make good music? |
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yes |
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1) This depends on how well you are able to teach yourself. 2) No. 3) Yes. 4) I'm not sure I understand the question. Do you mean knowedge about melody and composition for the latter option? I believe melody and progression are more important than pure technical know-how. 5) Sometimes. 6) Both. |
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Where to start? Can you recommend some books or information sources on net for electronic music making (for advanced or novice students)? |
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Zephyr Twin> It is a fact that knowing electronics gives you advantage in making music with more complex hardware. Just becouse all music is electrical signals sines, saws....Conception of frequency, modulation and so on must be known in order to understand what you doing and in order to achieve what you want. So my quastion was not only "know how" but basicly "whats going on there in equipment, and how to know what is better?". q 4? |
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music isn't always architecture, as much as like to listen to teh IDMz and wank my ego. |
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i started to make music with no musical education at all. in fact i still don't have any. i can't read notes nor write my melodies on paper. every melody i ever made was created with my mouse and trial and error. but i don't feel like less a musician because of that. maybe less an artist but not less musician. what i mean by "less artist" is the fact that i always supposed that a "real artist" is someone who creates something that is going on in his mind and that reflects his personal thoughts directly. the problem here is that my music doesn't do it. when i have a particular melody in mind i'm not able to put it into my daw because by the time i put down the first three notes by trial and error i forgot the idea i had in my head. that's sometimes a bit saddening. (sidenote - i'm currently trying to write a little app which allows me to whistle some melody into a microphone and then it spits out the according midi notes which might be useful) this way i could say that my music is in fact very cold and has no feelings in it at all. it's in fact pure maths and physics. at least i have a harmony-sense which allows me to keep my tracks clean. |
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1) no 2) dunno 3) yes/no 4) need more data 5) of course 6) what's good music ? |
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1) no 2) don't know 3) yes 4) neither is important to me 5) yes 6) you'll have to define "good" music |
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"good music" = music acceptable for particular group of people and makes influence to other artists. |
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1) no 2) dunno 3) yeah 4) the most important thing for me is to do not get too excited, it makes me lose the concentration 5) yeah 6) i'd say that your willing to express is more important than making music acceptable for particular group of people and makes influence to other artists |
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Why don't you pick up a book on synthesis and read about signal flow and how sounds are produced and manipulated before you do anything else. get yourself a synth, either a soft synth or hardware, but keep in mind if you use software you might need a midi controller to play the notes. I am similar to sadist I have little musical knowledge, I went to Uni to study music technology, but honestly i learned far more in my own bedroom while jamming around in reaktor than i did in class. You will find it hard to find books on how to write electronic music, because most tutorials only show you how to operate the software or hardware, but you have to work out the rest on your own good luck |
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i once downloaded but have never read it since. i have the pdf, just pm me if you wantS it |
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seems we're +/- agreed. too bad i'm heterosexual. |
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actually to answer the rest of the questions: 2.) most of the artists i know which i admire are the ones who have a horrible workflow, use like really crappy software, care shit about mastering but create great tracks by just, i don't know, magic. a few months ago a friend which i didn't know that she was even making music released a really nice ep which sounds very mature, professional and personal after a few weekds work on fruity loops. i was smashed 3.) as i said before, is started of with no knowledge at all. you can make music like this of course but you will end up frustrated very often by the fact that you won't be able to achieve a certain sound you were thinking off. it improves your work flow also when you just know which cable to put where to make what. put as i sadi you can start from zero. 4.) yes and no. as i said i lie the moment of creating a song, goofind around with sounds and trying different ideas. it's very satisfying. on the other hand i get frustrated very often when publish a track or give it ti friends or something. the thing is that i like to do very complex tracks. but sometimes i just have a day where i make some shitty techno track or some remix and suddenly everyone around is bawing "oh you could make music like thatand you make that idm bullshit" 5.) both. but you can have satisfying results with no talent at all. |
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I know basics of sound physics, and synthesis but composing music is dificult for me. Should I dig it deeper? Or maybe I better choose to learn composition - architecture of music. I feel same like sadist - I cant express music even I know how it should sound like. |
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works for me, obara. i'll look forward to gettin' all up in your lady parts. |
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oh i was assuming you had limited knowledge, in that case it's a good idea to get piano or keyboard lessons, i was thinking about it recently |
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>sadist It seems like you discover everything by experimenting with sounds. First I choosed same path, sure its fun and etc but seems it takes much time to achieve what u want. I just speculated maybe there is quicker way. |
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>larn But learning to play on particular instrument is not easy way to learn composing electronic music isnt it? |
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>larn And ofcourse investment is needed in this case. |
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can i listen to whatever track you've already produced ? just to get the overal image, if that's not a problem |
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the problem is that knowledge itself won't help you at all. i mean it's useless that you know you have to, for example, boost the high frequencies of a sound to achieve some effect when you don't know how to do that. i personally think that someone who wants to make music should just download floops or ableton live and jam along without reading stuff at all and just trying stuff out. |
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let me explain how it works with me, I am still an amateur, but i find it's all about being organized I use Logic, it's a sequencer which i think is only avaiLbale on the MAC, before I open a new project I think about what i am going to do, i have many different ways of working, so for example, i am going to write some glitchy electronic music, i open a default configuration for logic which has been pre saved as a template. I have may different ways of working depending on what I am doing, so one day i will chose a template purely geared about making beats, the next day i will open one for mixing down, etc. So if you want to work quickly, you need to be well organized and know where everything is, that means making templates and having your files organized ie audio files drums samples etc |
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ask music maker. |
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>obara Usualy I delete everythig I create, becouse I do not want to listen that again, its so primitive and experimental, basicly lack of skill. >sadist I always thought that knolage helps to do better music. For example if you lisyen to pro jazz artists you can feel that their inprovisation is more intresting to you, more atractive, and newbies just cant do it becouse lack of experience and thoughts on experimenting something. Thoughts cames from knowlage, as far as I know. >sandy Quastions is rised. And I think those problems are universal to everybody, so it is important to answer them and share experience to make better music. |
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>larn organisation of sounds is important for performane. But also I think it is not easy task. |
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knowledge is not experience and vice versa. i doesn't make the jazz artist play better when he reads a book about it or watches a movie. when he has mastered his instrument that much that he knows every aspect of expression on it than only practice can make him play better. |
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No Don't Know, also depends on what you mean by 'educated' Yes Don't know where you draw the line exactly, I think they are both important or not important together Thats Private Hard Work |
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it is good to have some understanding of scales, chord structures, time signatures, and the basic fundamentals of music theory. you don't have to be able to read or write sheet music, but just knowing the basics will make it a lot easier to get results, fix problems, etc. you are right in your thinking about the jazz improv guy.. who is going to shoot better from the hip; a trained marksman or some guy who just picked up a piece on the street? what you learn should be applied tho. for this kind of music, you should also have an understanding of synthesis and recording; perhaps just a bit more so even. oscillator, filter, gain, insert & send effect, bit rate, pattern, track, midi vs audio, should be in your brain glossary just as much, if not more, than 5th, scale, chord, etc. don't get too bogged down in academia, tho. develop and build your tool box, but remember the end goal is not to know everything there is to know about tools but to be able to use them. limit your focus to what can be applied and integrated into how you make music. |
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This is a good easy read on music theory made by a guy who thought that all those folks making shitty electronic music should understand a few basics of music theory |
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4 and 6 = both said no to the top one. the rest were yes. |
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>sadist "knowledge is not experience and vice versa. i doesn't make the jazz artist play better when he reads a book about it or watches a movie. when he has mastered his instrument that much that he knows every aspect of expression on it than only practice can make him play better." when you practice you gain knowlage right? I claim that without knowlage music cant exist. Becouse every track can be represented as algorithm, and you can learn from this. How you can build experience without knowlage? >mappatazee "Don't Know, also depends on what you mean by 'educated'" Have basic understanding about music. "Don't know where you draw the line exactly, I think they are both important OR not important together" I dont understand you. >glasse >larn >sadist thanx for advice. I think it will be useful. >preii thanx for source >Mission AD I also agree that education is not needed to make music. But if we talk about "good" music I thik it is crusal to learn about things u do. |
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Music to me basically comes down to techniques. In theory you don't have to know any techniques to make music, you can just make whatever you want, but if that music was judged by someone else, it might not get good reviews. If you want to duplicate techniques from others, you obviously have to learn them. But you can also accidently do them even if you don't know them. Also, there is no 'good' music, at least not in an objective way. We all have music we despise that others love, and vice versa. We can then separate between technical music, and emotional music. Some people may not like the tune, but they realize it's complex, although not emotional. Some people think a tune is emotional, but not very complex. Then again some people think complexity must be present for beauty to emerge, and thus all simple music is not good. But then you have to describe where the complexity lies and what it means. A simple song can have a complex timbre, and a complex melody can have a simple timbre. Both can bring emotion.. One can create complex melodies AND timbre, WITHOUT knowing any technical facts about neither, believe it or not. Well this can go on forever, but I hope I got my point across. |
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hey there what is that? |
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hi. This is audio book (mp3 24 kbps 8000 Hz Joint Stereo) |
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aesthetics bre, aesthetics |
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"How to make a noise" is the most comprehensive guide to synthesiser programming techniques and covers: * subtractive synthesis * FM * additive synthesis * wave sequencing, and * sample based synthesis. |
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I know people that know nearly all the ins and outs of music theory, but can't make music for shit, and the other way around. I know people that hardly know how a synthesizer actually works, but they did get chosen as best act by the audience. I know people that have the most amazing talent, but their talent is copying other artists rather than coming up with their own stuff. So in other words, any combination of "yes"es and "no"s on your questions gives a different result, but in the end all results render 'MUSIC' :D |
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>cwnt aesthetics is foundation of our culture. >khrimson thx. Planing to read this stuff. Looks simple and practical. >Fah It is obvious that making music is not only knowledge, I think its knowledge plus talent. Also you dont have to know synthesizer circuitry in order to work with it, same is with car someone drive. But show me rally driver who dont know where is certain car systems and how they perform. I mean that maybe you can be good musicmaker without knowing much about stuff you do, but can then this person say that he loves music, and can we say that this person can reach his full potential without actually knowing what he is doing and what it means. |
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I don't think you can go on for very long without any knowledge of what you're doing, ie you'll learn along the way. I think one is rather stubborn if they end up making music for 7 years and still not know what the hell he or she is doing. |
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process is awesome, the end result should be like the reward. Just like painting, do small studies first, build it up, and then make that shit happen. money is also a problem. |
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agree. It maybe impossible to ignore knowledge of fields where you working. But complexity in music is not necessarily is beauty, this means that we theoretically one can build original track with basic knowledge about music. Maybe sort of isolation from main stream techniques for musicmaking is key to make music you rly like. I think oversteps and quaristice is sort of examples of that. |
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woah six hours |
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5 minutes i had to start some ambient under this voice becomes interesting |
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21 minutes busta rhymes mentioned |
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i think for me the good thing about making music is the process itself, how melodies take form, how sounds interacts, how tune changes... and i think its more fun when you know nothing and your are discovering and learning thru the process. althought musical knowledge allows to make you more nice/impressing things and you (me) are more satisfied with the result. Musical education, is it necessary to make music? no Is it posible to learn music by just using intuition, and playing with sounds? of course, music is inside you Technical knowlage (hardware/software) vs knowlage about music which is more important for you and why? technical = instrument, a previous part to creating Do you feel pleased with music which you make? yes(when making), then no(when finished), then sometimes (when relistening after the time. Is it talent or hard work to make good music? who knows! |
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'pitch is a purely psycological phenomenon related to the frequency of vibrating air molecules. by psycological, i mean that it is entirely in our heads, not in the world out there. it is the end product of a chain of mental events that arise to an entirely subjective internal mental representation or quality' |
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34:42 |
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