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I just saw this quote from Rob Brown, We do celebrate the futurism of that behaviour, but we’re here, it’s 2008, and kids might just presume the requirement to be hit with loads of detail and overlaid effects is there just to be valid – and I think that’s where it goes a bit wrong and people miss the point. We’ll get hit with, “oh it’s all random, algorithmic and generative” and if somebody can’t work out its metric arrangement, and can’t worked out if it’s looped or not, then they’re going to hit it and say it’s random twaddle. And that’s quite hurtful in a way, we don’t really get too upset by critics, but it just means that some people have missed the point. and it got me thinking.. back when i first heard of autechre, i didnt know anything about how music was made. and its only after i began to make idm myself, that i realized how truly amazing and well done ae's sounds are, from a technical AND creative perspective. i do try to learn how to do it myself, but i notice people who dont know about music making, usually just tag it off as if the computer generated everything for me. as if its easy to do. and thats because they dont really know how difficult it is to create this sort of stuff like ae does, it's not immediately available in any software or hardware out there. mass public recognizes that creating melody and progressions are difficult, but not this type of music, and --- it kind of pisses me off. i find a rare quality to music which is technically amazing, it adds a whole new dimension beyond the mere first impression. to me half the magic is in how brilliant the sounds are and the creation of those sounds, and i wish listeners would hear that too. of course idm fans arent like this, most of the time, but speak to any hiphop/rap/pop fan and they'll write it off as random bleeps the computer shat out by itself. and thats quite hurtful indeed. |
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ma che te ne fotte =) |
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i hate people that think drukqs is the best rdj album, because they'll probably think so because it's the most technical |
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It's especially odd if people level that at you when it's the harmonic and melodic ideas are what come most naturally to you, and you're choosing to focus on sound design/texture/unusual rhythmic ideas to challenge yourself. Just because someone's music doesn't contain much in the way of obvious melodic content, does not mean they're incapable of producing beautiful melodies. Ignore those folk and continue to do what keeps your brain challenged and what feels creative to you. :-) |
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Any Bass? |
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thanks a lot man! i feel its only in the past year or two that ive really begun to get a firm grasp of where i want to go and what i want to explore musically. i have not in any way abandoned melody, it's just im taking a break because good sounds and unusual rhythms really give me something completely different to melody. its very refreshing if i were to just focus on melody for the rest of my life, id be missing out, and i kind of feel others might be missing out too, but you know, i cant be a judge of others musical taste, i gotta follow my own, just like they gotta follow theirs. i just hope my music doesnt become TOO obscure and unpleasant, and i certainly do not feel it has yet. |
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bass is important! so yes! lots of bass! |
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if you want to be stimulated by technicality in music go listen to dreamtheater or some other bullshit music with too many notes flying around. |
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hahah :D |
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naw coem on, i dunn oabout no dream theeter |
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you prefer yngwie malmsteen? |
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never heard oif him nah not really, i dont lkisten to him |
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drukqs is the best rdj album |
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no it's not |
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it has cool sounds |
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very |
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technicallity equals not musicallity |
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it's his best non-ambient album |
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people do not bow down to technicality because it doesn't fucking matter how difficult the music was to make so long when it still sounds shit. listen to stockhousen or some other early serial music - hugely techincally difficult, but it's unfuckinglistenable. |
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i likes organic shit werd |
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w3rd |
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melodies made up with technically brilliant sounds ...of which those actual sounds are made up of techinically brilliant meloides using sounds that are techincally brilliant ...add some spaces of silence ...leave to stand a little and serve with your favorite 'erbs. |
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if it got bass i am down with it |
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I've had people calling my taste in music/my own music shit all the time, you just gotta ignore them. There's plenty of people who share my taste in music and also respect the music I make too. It's art. Everyone has a critique. |
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at the end you could never become a musician if you're good a music but you suck at maths |
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I am sure there is music that YOU think is shit too - and delight in telling everyone that it's shit. The fact is, The Spice Girls is no more or less better/worthy than Aphex Twin - as music is totally unquantifiable with regard to taste. And popularity is no measure of anything, after all, God appears to be very popular and there's no evidence that the entity even exists. |
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I find the real prob is that many don't class music as clever unless it's making a show of being arty. Anything that isn't completely cluttered with twitchy sounds wont do.....unless it did that on purpose to make a similar arty musical statement. I've had trouble from those who don't get IDM, but i've had more from people who have IDM rammed up their arse. If it dosn't reverse, drop into a bit-crushed gurgle, then split into 5 horrible patterns that only work if you give a shit, then people just wont be interested. |
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AMPI: That is because IDM is really just a hodgepodge of styles, ideas, & schools of thought that not everyone agrees on. It's more of a movement, than a style innit. The intelligent techno of the 90s, ok you could get away with calling that IDM as a style, but today those artists have so gone in their own directions that it is almost too subdivided to even be thought of as a genre. Back in the day, you could listen to MHTRTC, ICBYD, and Tri-Rep and get a sense of a pretty common thing going on. Can you do the same with Campfire, Quaristice & Rushup Edge? Let's throw in Hello Everything & 8000 BC? Some people are ecclectic enough to still get down with all or most of it, but for a lot of other people that is asking too much and they are drawing lines in the sand. |
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So you can't be an imaginative musicians and be appalling at maths.! ? |
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i like the sound of cicadas and they arent very technical, i saw one fly into a window once. do you believe me? |
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lol ampi, idm is one thing, but what im really interested in is eh, the aesthetic of sound, so to speak. like its unfathomable to me that someone cant like tewe or uviol, it really is, because im in awe at the tracks all the time. then i show it to someone whos not into it, and its like they just write it off as boring music. taste is one thing, but to not hear the inherent quality of merely the production is another. i guess im just a production whore, when ikt comes to others music, but i also can appreciate bad production but good ideas. so i dunno |
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for the longest time cultures will refer to something as one thing but then another culture will come a long and tell you what it really is and they will really do it right |
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of course you can be imaginative but if you suck at maths - the rational part of the bizness, the constancy and the technical skills that make the difference between a man and a children - then.. well, i think you could never be a musician. |
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The actual musicality of sound is the most important. This is what seperates Autechre from most of the clones out there. They have an amazing sense of rhythm and melody, whereas your average IDM producer gets obsessed with sounds without any real musical context. This is my main beef with Clark actually, as he is clearly an amazing producer, but I find his music hard to connect to as I just feel that a lot of the time, his music is more of a technical workout rather than something from the heart. Innovative sounds are great, but without the right musical context, they are nothing. |
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that's right, but musicality all alone is nothing in the same way. once i've been part of a project of two where i was clearly the one with less technical skills. we got an mp3 release and many promises but after the project came to its natural end, i couldn't go anywhere but here in my imaginary world. must be hard to find someone to be true with, and musically sympathetic at the same time. |
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Yes, I reckon both are equally important. I'd find listening to some kid with big ideas but awful production just as annoying as amazingly produced but otherwise sterile emotion-deprived sounds. Actually, at least with good production you can go, "oooh, that's quite nicely produced" and then promptly turn it off. If you've got good musical ideas your owe to them to get clued up on the technical side of things, to get them fully realized, imo. There's no one right way to approach production, but the more you learn the more inventive and fun sounding it can get. It might mean becoming a hermit, but never mind. |
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Then again, that could well all be rubbish, because many great things come out of accidents and out of a lack of knowledge. Perhaps it's just a case of diving into the sound current and being honest and working hard and enjoying it all. |
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Youre right boys. I wasn't raggin on the IDMness of IDM but the attitudes of some IDM enthusiasts. Well, actually, i'm raggin on fashion as a whole. Its natural to like music for more reasons than how it sounds eg: the way its made ect. But i have found that some people dont realise the excellence in a piece of tunage just cos it dosn't flip around like a fish out of water. I was with this guy that was a bit of a div and he said that aphex twin was shit cos vsnares is much more complex and clever. Now, not that i dont appreciate vsnares, but RDJ is not to be written off even if that was true. He was all like 'aphex twin dosn't even use (insert tech speak algorithm stuff) and his stuff isn't even clever'. He even said he wanted to hit me cos i did this wanky piss take of 'my eyes are black and whiiiiiiite' which really upset him. Don't worry though cos i told him he was wrong and that he was a spaz and managed to scare him off by crushing a mug on my forhead. He's not the only one of his type i've bumped into, however most folks stand where i stand and have an open mind on the whole ting. |
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RDJs stuff is pretty freakin detailed. Just cause he isn't focused on breaks as much right now doesn't mean anything. The synth work on analord and the tuss is amazing and very detailed. The fact that a lot of the sounds RDJ uses are classic makes it better for what he is doing. Also RDJs beats, melodies and overall composition is generally very clever imo. VS owns the break, and finds pretty clever ways of dressing it up w/ noise, classical, etc., but he ain't better than RDJ. It's like saying RDJ isn't as good as Jenkinson because he doesn't play live bass. It's stupid. I'm glad there is such a diverse range of music out there, if they all used the same techniques they'd end up sounding the same which is boring. |
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It's not diverse though. |
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please refer to post [#02220568] |
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Yes, I had a look but it's not thugh |
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# nails it I think. |
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this thread is now diverse. |
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Aphex twits and Venetian snails are radically different? |
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Well they are more similar than Aphex and AE are, or Divine and Vibert are, but they still offer unique characteristics which make them diverse. How is diveristy often used today? Often in the workplace right, HR and all that. Am I radically different than other races of humans? Do I have extra limbs or organs, horns or wings? I don't think diverse has to mean radical, it could refer to things that are mostly similar, but have just a few unique characteristics. |
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You, or they are not unique in any way. Haha! Horns and wings! Throw a 60 sided die whether you are a cunt or not. |
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This conversation sucks |
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