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Hey Ceri! Wow... you been going long? I'll have to come down to Bristol to train one week. I might even see you at a few gradings! ;) (PS. Prolly won't post much today. quite busy at work.) |
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Oh yea.... I'm going this evening! :D Also I'm going to the 30 years of BKFA celebration in Birmingham. Ask at your class if anyone there is going. Cheers mate! |
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Oi Ceri.... If I don't speak to you... have fun tomorrow night, yea?! bye |
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Will do, I'll let you know how I get on. Are gradings traditionally part of Lau Gar or have they been introduced just to meet BKFA regulations? I remember our Dragon Club only brought them in to be able to join the BKFA... It'd def. be cool for you to come down to train. Wait till I've been going for a few weeks though :) Have you (or your Sifu) ever come into contact with Sean Vierra? |
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I've not but my Sifu, Phil Seal has a couple of times but If I ever go to train with another club, it'll be either Cirencester or Gloucester. I'll give Bristol a go sometime tho. Yea, The gradings are a BKFA thing, founded 30 years ago by Master Yau. Bristol has quite a large class hasn't it? |
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"Bristol has quite a large class hasn't it?" I'll let you know tommorow :) Sean runs a kickboxing club on another night as well which I might start if I'm not too knackered after kung-fu. |
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Yea sounds good. It's all done by BKFA. The incorporate the Kung fu into the Kickboxing class. You prolly know already but... be patient with Lau Gar. I'll be surprised of you get to do alot of Sparing. Save that for the kick boxing. ;) Rite bra? |
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I know about the abscence of sparring. My old sifu said he used to be into sparring, but an "incident" on the street convinced him it wasn't very effective as a training method. I am a patient person, I don't expect to be one inch punching in 2 weeks :) How similair is lau gar to kickboxing? I've sparred with a lau gar guy before and whilst it seemed a "lanky" persons art, like a long form of dragon style it didn't seem to similair to kick boxing... Is the kickboxing actual muay thai or westernised boxing with kicks (as is popular in the US)? |
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They just wanted it to appeal to everyone one but rather than include that "appeal" in the martial art, They Started the kickboxing to. Dunno exactly what it's like tho. Lau Gar is very ground based, balanced, mainly punch techniques finished off with mainly mid level kick techniques. Although alot of lanky or tall people do it (myself inc.), It's a very close art, really sneaky and also dirty. Simialar to how you described the Dragon style you studied. Ask Sean about it all... He'll tell you everything you need to know. Tell him bout me too! :) I'd like to meet him. Also, check out some of the yellow sash (my grade) stuff the others are doing. It looks really good. |
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Will do, it'll take a while for me to get back into the whole gradiongs thing... the only distinction made in dragon (until a few weeks before I stopped going) was master/student. We were all taught the same stuff. It'll be like going back to judo having gradings :) When you say ground based do you mean there is no jumping (like in han gar) or do you mean there is groundwork as in judo/jui-jitsu. My gf has just started jui-jitsu/self defense classs. It's suprising, the self defense classes I've seen before have been based around judo or karate... |
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There are flying kicks (jumps with kicks in the air basically) but most of it is about the whole body and posture feeling strong without being tense, starting with the ground then coming up throught feet, body then into the fist, power then its gone and back to a relaxed state, whist feeling strong. Hmm I think thats covered it. The whole Grading thing is only to attract the westerners. You'll still do alot of stuff that you shouldn't be doing yet so its shouldn't be all that strict. |
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"You'll still do alot of stuff that you shouldn't be doing yet so its shouldn't be all that strict." Yeah, I remember they let this guy at dragon have a go with butterfly swords when it was his second week - crazy! Are there many throws/locks in Lau Gar? I remember at dragon my judo came in really handy, it was cool the way the masters used to respect my knowledge of throws & stuff and learnt some locks from me... |
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Not as far as the syllabus goes (Handy for the knife defence sets) but locks and holds ahould be taught as something extra to add when blocking a punch or something. I'd imagine you'd get the same sort of respect at the club in Bristol. They should be teaching forms of self defence at the class too and also (my favourite) Sticking hand competitions. You'll have to find out about this yourself as it's tough to explain. |
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Oh yea... Did you do any Pressure point work in Dragon style? |
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Yeah, I remeber sticking hand, we only did a little bit of it, but I seemed to have a natural apptitude for it. We did it where you are continually touching arms (moving) and have to try and lock the other person when they try to push your arm away. We did a small amount of pressure point work, our master was sceptical about the effectiveness of some of them (he was a herbalist by trade & used some of them in his practice though...) so only taught us the ones he believed really worked. |
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Cool.... You're gonna fit right in I reckon. Again, let me know how it went, although I won't be able to reply till Tuesday |
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Will do, I'll have to bring my pads etc. down to Bristol now that I'm back in training, still I don't have anywhere to hang my kick bag and unfortunately I'm not allowed to hang it from the beams in my parents garage as I damaged the beams in our old house :( |
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Here you go mate... check it out http://www.laugar-kungfu.com/news.htm |
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Cheers for the link, the competiton rules sound interesting. I think it's good that you don't get penalised for playing defensively- I used to like waiting for someone to attack in judo then counter them or make a half-arsed attack, then counter their counter, but you were always in danger of being penalised for not attacking. The idea was introduced to make it more of a spectator sport, it probably helped it get olympic recognition... Are there lau gar semi-contact competions for non black/brown sash competitors (the site didn't really make it clear...)? I liked the history of lau gar section, although it seemed more of a generic kung fu one than specific to lau gar. Do you know what the literla translation of lau gar is? Presumably, it's (something) clan? |
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Yea you can enter competitions of all grades. not even pitched against same graded students. Prolly white to orange and green to purple too. Gar is family/Clan as you well know. Lau is 3 eyed Tiger Lau (Coz he had a scar that resembled a 3rd eye) He founded Lau Gar and Grand Master Jeremey Yau (Founder of the BKFA) is a direct descendant. S'all I know cept its a southern style (obvious). What you'll notice is the stance (Left Fighting) is fairly standard but originally (Altered for the westeners) was a hanging stance. I'd prefer the hanging stances but they's now decided on balence. The set blocks for the Syllabus aren't that effective or logical and we're always saying "it'd be better to do this" but it's all traditional and designed to teach you various ideas. You just have to take it all away and use the right techniques at the right time. As they say. Black sash is more like the completion of an induction rather than a final goal. |
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O my god the typos |
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Ah I'd heard about the 3-eyed tiger guy before, I just didn't know he was the lau gar founder... In a fit of idiocy I went along to the wednesday time on thursday night and hence missed the class, but I'm going tommorow (saturday) as I resolved to start this week :) |
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Wierd, I used to do Lau Gar and got to be a purple sash. I then went to Liverpool and got my ass whipped by a blue sash Hung Gar. Hung Gar is the original, Jeramy Lau started a school in Birmingham, it became Lau Gar. Find a Hung Gar school and get an education. I do Ju Jitsu and general brawling now!!! |
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Funny how Lau Gar happens to have introduced semi contact to the western world tho isnt it? And how It's the most traditional martial art to still compete in competitions and win. Hung Gar isn't the original. They're all deviations. Jeremy YAU started it in Birmingham and was Lau Gar coz of 3 eyed Tiger Lau, not Hung. Don't flame someone elses art. It's not nice. |
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Hehe. I thought this was a thread about Laurent Garnier. |
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Yep, it's pointless getting into lineage and "I beat him so my art is better" debates. It's particularly dense to do in the "real world" I know of rivalries between schools that have caused serious injury and vandalism. People still get into silly feuds over which school of hung gar is "genuine". The answer is simple, they are all different styles, the name is just a very common one (red clan) much like Jones or Smith in the UK. My advice is try a few different ones and see which one suits you best. And in any event they're (chinese/japanese ones at least) all pretty much certianly offspring of Wushu... |
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Did you enjoy your first Lau Gar experience? I met Jeremy Yau yesterday! He's such a sound bloke. Came up to Phil and I, all smiles and jokes. Got a shit load of photos with him |
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Ha ha, I mangaed to sleep through my alarm/turned it off in my sleep on saturday and I woke up 20 mins before it started... I've asked all my flatmates to remind me to go to on wednesday, set a reminder on my PC etc. and laid my kit out ready. I'm going to be early tonight - no excuse for missing it! Meeting Jeremy Lau sounds cool, I remember meeting the guy who brought Dragon style to the UK. Really friendly humble guy who didn't talk down to you at all. He was on a channel 4 program not too long ago. |
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I'm going tonight. One of my flatmates might come too. I'll let you know how I get on... |
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Aching arms, but glad to be back training. Very similair to dragon style, although I'm not sure I like the stance as much. It's admittedly more stable than dragon, but in dragon that's componsated for by the way you move. You just feel your groin is awfully exposed in the Lau Gar stance. I overdid the training a bit and nearly blacked out, probably due to a combination of lack of sleep and the first really vigorous exercise in about a year. It happened a couple of times in Dragon style, so I'm used to it. The class is huge (70-80) compared to my old one (8-9, half of whom were seniors) which is a bit different, this particular club seems far more westernised than mine, but it's still a good laugh. |
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I think I've learnt quite a bit from going to this meal thing.... It's unfortunatly starting to become a massive tool to scout for British fighters. getting quite commercialised. My club (Tetbury) isn't advertised and consists of about 11 students. My master loves teaching us old Lau and tells us of the old stance (front foot hanging as opposed to both feet grounded) He's not happy about the speed people are climbing the "ladder" as it's starting to create sgood fighters but shoddy techniques. It's still enjoyable tho. The groin thing is open but the walk compensates. Thing to remember is the cresant, groin protecting, walk as it is use for everything. Was it a cool class tho? |
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It did seem a great deal more commercial than my old class. It seemed to be a hybrid of dragon style & westernised kickboxing. I prefer the old stance (it's cat stance right?) esp. good against other non-kung fu martial artists as they have a tendancy of trying to sweep it allowing you to pin their foot etc. Is was giving half an eye to the rest of the class and there did appear to be some blue belts (is that reasonably high?) who were "sloppy" in their movements. The other students were all friendly though. I found the usual thing after nearly blacking out that I was actually better as a result as I was more relaxed and blows didn't hurt me. One of the guys I was training with was quite perterbed when I started counting chinese under my breath in time to my punches (old habits die hard :) ) when we were practicing. I like the hand movements, very similair to dragon kung-fu. I imagine It'll take me a couple of months to lose the old muscle memory of dragon, but I'll definately keep going. |
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I think The dragon style will help alot. Blue is the second sash you get but even then it should take about a year to obtain from starting Lau. I hate blacking out but yea, I find that I'm more relaxed too. I always question why I do Lau Gar as I'm 6'2" and most of that is leg. Lau is really grounded, tight hand techniques. Keep it up mate coz you'll get something to hold your trousers up soon! :) |
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Where's the nearest Dragon style to me? could you find out for me? cheers. (BBCs "Changing Styles" with Carol Smilie) |
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I'm not sure how many clubs there are, I'll try to find out for you though. It's far less prolific than Lau Gar. Last I heard there were only 2 "open" clubs in Wales and they were both affilated. Not sure how many in England though. It's generally very underground and they tend not to teach westerners. Many china towns will have a small dragon club somewhere, as it's a very popular style in china (both the triads and hong kong police use it as their main style) but like I say they're unlikely to let you in. I know there's a club in Canton (cardiff's china town) that were friendly in that the club's owner would give us reduced price in his store if we wore our uniform and gave the dragon salute, but he wouldn't train/compete with us (probably because only our sifu was Chinese). |
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Have you blacked out in training then? First my hearing goes as if I'm underwater and if I can't see the instructors lips I have difficulty telling what we're meant to be doing, then I get grey around my vision, finally all my strength goes and I have to sit down or I know I'd pas sout. One of my mates who did Tae Kwando (he now studies Dragon) used to just force himself to keep going till he blacks out when he got like that. I've always been tempted as it shows you're not just pussying out because you're out of breath or whatever, but I've always thought it'd be quite selfish due to the disruption it'd cause in the class... It nearly happened in Judo a few times when people were slow to release you from choke holds when you started tapping. The people I met before I started training who did Lau Gar said that it favoured lanky people (like kickboxing I suppose), but I don't think height plays as big a role in it as people make out. I'm going to either start kempo jui-jitsu or akido as well as I miss grappling. My frame/build is more suited to that and I used to be reasonable in competition. |
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