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Class & Art
 

offline jonesy from Lisboa (Portugal) on 2003-01-07 05:13 [#00504854]
Points: 6650 Status: Lurker



There is a debate raging on my workplace music MB about
social class and music. Do you see a relationship?


 

offline bill_hicks from my city is amazing it is calle on 2003-01-07 05:14 [#00504857]
Points: 4286 Status: Lurker



yes.


 

offline jonesy from Lisboa (Portugal) on 2003-01-07 05:18 [#00504865]
Points: 6650 Status: Lurker



Care to elaborate?


 

offline Ceri JC from Jefferson City (United States) on 2003-01-07 05:22 [#00504869]
Points: 23533 Status: Moderator | Show recordbag



Go to Cardiff Museum on a Saturday afternoon. I know that's
art and culture rather than music, but it is mainly either
parents with kids, middle class tourists, art student types
or generally middle class people.

One of the people who introduced a lot of "this sort of
music" FSOL, Fluke etc. to me was a labourer, so I guess
that defeats the IDM is for middle class kids argument.


 

offline magiker from Östersund (Sweden) on 2003-01-07 05:22 [#00504870]
Points: 865 Status: Lurker



Well, punk music is for punks...
Serial killers listens to "hip to be square" and such. It's
true! I live next door to.. oh wait... what's... noooooo*


 

offline bill_hicks from my city is amazing it is calle on 2003-01-07 05:23 [#00504871]
Points: 4286 Status: Lurker



Are you talking about the people who make the music or the
people who listen to the music? I see a direct link in both
cases but in slightly different ways.


 

offline bill_hicks from my city is amazing it is calle on 2003-01-07 05:25 [#00504874]
Points: 4286 Status: Lurker | Followup to magiker: #00504870



you swedish and your wacky ways!!


 

offline Ceri JC from Jefferson City (United States) on 2003-01-07 05:26 [#00504875]
Points: 23533 Status: Moderator | Show recordbag



What do you reckon Jonesy? Is art an unneccesary product of
the bourgeios?


 

offline bill_hicks from my city is amazing it is calle on 2003-01-07 05:40 [#00504890]
Points: 4286 Status: Lurker



PERCENT LIKING OR LIKING A LOT CLASSICAL MUSIC

AGE GROUPS
CLASS 18-35 36-59 60+ TOTAL
Lower 25 32 35 30%
Working 45 46 37 44%
Middle 48 59 59 56%
Upper 70 74 67 73%
TOTAL 46% 52% 40% 50%

PERCENT LIKING OR LIKING ALOT BIG BAND/SWING MUSIC

AGE GROUPS
CLASS 18-35 36-59 60+ TOTAL
Lower 37 40 64 46%
Working 43 57 66 54%
Middle 47 66 83 66%
Upper 50 73 83 72%
TOTAL 45% 61% 75% 60%

PERCENT LIKING COUNTRY/WESTERN VERY MUCH

AGE GROUPS
CLASS 18-35 36-59 60+ TOTAL
Lower 19 47 22 30%
Working 23 32 34 29%
Middle 18 18 22 19%
Upper 9 32 8 18%
TOTAL 20% 27% 26% 24%

PERCENT WITH MIXED FEELINGS OR DISLIKE OF GOSPEL MUSIC

AGE GROUPS
CLASS 18-35 36-59 60+ TOTAL
Lower 49 25 11 30%
Working 50 32 20 36%
Middle 55 49 30 46%
Upper 64 68 25 56%
TOTAL 52% 40% 25% 40%



 

offline bill_hicks from my city is amazing it is calle on 2003-01-07 05:41 [#00504891]
Points: 4286 Status: Lurker



relationship between social status and aesthetic
sensitivities has long been observed, producing "highbrow"
and "lowbrow" distinctions of tastes. Underly such
designations, of course, is the implied superiority of the
former over the latter. To be "highbrow" means having
cultivated aesthetic sensitivities and appreciation which
the "uncultured" masses don't have as they require
considerable education, sophistication, and "class." In
other words, it is another dimension by which the social
elite can claim specialness and worthiness of others'
deference. To be "high" means not being "low" in the social
hierarchy, and it is those in power positions who so label
their social lessers in order to protect their power and
prestige.

How specific leisure pursuits and preferences--i.e., forms
of sport (for instance, polo or fox hunting vs. boxing or
bowling), dance (i.e., ballet vs. Western), reading (i.e.,
Thackeray vs. comic books) and movie (i.e., "Rambo" vs.
"foreign films") preferences, and music -- become recognized
as being either high or low pro provide many fascinating
stories. For instance, Levine's Highbrow/Lowbrow argues how
Shakespeare was considered in the nineteen century U.S. to
be of the realm of popular culture, only to be transformed
by the "cultural elite" into an author of messages deemed
incomprehensible by the masses.

Critical theorists typically argue that the elite have
hegemony--defined by Antonio Gramsci (1971) as the way a
"certain way of life and thought is dominant, in which one
concept of reality is diffused thoughout public society in
all its institutions and private manifestations"-- over
aesthetic orders. Given the power of art--to maximize the
meaning-carrying capacity of cultural symbols and mediums,
to crystallize cultural anxieties or to push a culture's
emotional hot buttons--its control should, from the elites'
perspective, come from the top. Thus, the diffusion of
cultural modes should be expected to flow from the upper to
lower classes. However, the


 

offline Ceri JC from Jefferson City (United States) on 2003-01-07 05:55 [#00504909]
Points: 23533 Status: Moderator | Followup to bill_hicks: #00504891 | Show recordbag



Bang on. I've often pointed out in debate that Shakespeare
was (at the time) the equivalent of eastenders. There is
little hidden meaning in it. A lot of what is "read
into" shakespeare in the process of over-analysis is
actually just people seeing the language as something more
than it is.

A good example would be the 2 scenes in Macbeth where the
phrase "doubley redoubled" is used. I've heard English
teachers claim there is some mystical implied link between
these scenes. There isn't- it's just a phrase of the time
meaning a lot or in greater quantity.

Perhaps English teachers should study old english language
before they make rash assumptions about English literature
;)

Rant over.


 

offline jonesy from Lisboa (Portugal) on 2003-01-07 06:02 [#00504919]
Points: 6650 Status: Lurker | Followup to Ceri JC: #00504909



The same is true of classical music. It was once deemed part
of 'op culture' and was adopted as 'high-brow' culture by
the bourgeoise.


 


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