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 (nobody)...and 319 guests Last 5 registered Oplandisks nothingstar N_loop yipe foxtrotromeo Browse members... |
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Members 8025Messages 2613474 Today 12 Topics 127502 |
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Just for the sake of pointing it out, 3 tracks on 26 Mixes are definetaly mp3 sourced. Since I have the original tracks to compare I figured I'd post some spectrum shots to prove it. Not sure if anyone else has done so before. I also ran aucdtect on the album it showed the same... Processing file: [Aphex Twin - 26 Mixes For Cash (Disc 1) - 05 Philip Gla ss - Heroes (Aphex Twin Remix).wav] Data analysis: [100%] ----------------------------------------------------------- - This track looks like MPEG with probability 100% ----------------------------------------------------------- - Processing file: [Aphex Twin - 26 Mixes For Cash (Disc 1) - 06 Buck Tick - In The Glitter Part 2 (Aphex Twin Mix).wav] Data analysis: [100%] ----------------------------------------------------------- - This track looks like CDDA with probability 99% ----------------------------------------------------------- - Processing file: [Aphex Twin - 26 Mixes For Cash (Disc 1) - 09 Saint Etie nne - Your Head My Voice (Voix Revirement).wav] Data analysis: [100%] ----------------------------------------------------------- - This track looks like MPEG with probability 95% ----------------------------------------------------------- - And now the links to the spectrum shots... |
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Most obvious ones: Heroes remix (original on top) |
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Saint Etienne: Your Head My Voice |
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well? |
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Bit of a headache actually, but thanks for asking. |
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well what? |
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Missing remixes, track edits and now mp3s on CD. Bad Warp! |
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MOTHER FUCKERS |
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what does these spectra tell us? |
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nice work, m8. |
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BASTARDS |
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We're missing out on a quarter of a track. What's missing in the top bit? Maybe that's where you have to put ktpa to refill it? |
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Haha Warp exec: "Shit! Richard lost the original masters to three of the tracks!" Exec #2: "Load up Soulseek!" |
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I dare someone to send it back asking for a refund. DOUBLE DARE |
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Cheffe, they show the frequency (high and low) cutoffs initiated by the compression algorithms of MPEG layer 3. MP3 compression works by (in short) stripping out much of the high and low frequencies (mostly what humans can't hear anyways.) and this cuts down on the amount of data, and thus, file size. |
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ok, i should have read the initial post... |
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thanks, i just figured. i thought double0syx did the rips himself, oh well. so with that analord thingy it was argued that 'they want us to hear the whole thing' and thats why it's on vinly only, to prevent the 'fanbase' being turned off by 'shitty' cd quality versions? hopefully they don't press the mp3 version on vinly :) |
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most mp3 compressors, aside from LAME, cut off frequencies about 16Khz. As you can see in the spectrum, the track on 26 mixes have nothing above there. One of the 3 looks like it may have been a LAME mp3 since the frequencies go to about 19.5Khz, which is LAME's aps or apx cutoff. I think I'll email warp and send the pictures. Be curious to see if I get a response.... |
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thats something to expect from some cheap mp3boy netlabel hahha i can remember nacmat saying ' i have already downloaded it, but i will get the cd tomorrow, then i will know what it sounds like' hihihi |
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I've emailed them now and I inclluded the spectrum shots. I'll be suprised if I hear back from them. |
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I'll be suprised if they would care. |
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nice work.. |
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if it's true it's not cool but let's not jump to conclusion too quickly, maybe the masters are really lost or they cut out these parts because it was mostly hi-freq noise... i dunno, i don't mean to play devil's advocate but i doubt they'd do something mlike that without good good reasons... |
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Fact remains that anyone could have made that CD on the bedroom computer, aside from the cover "art" and CD print. I guess we're all stupid for buying it as a fan's must-have. |
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so we have been cheated? we are stupid? why does richard or warp do that? |
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whered you get the originals? |
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i mean.. if the originals are floating about cyberspace then warp/richie are cockheads |
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the originals are in the original albums where th mixes were incluede I imagine... was that the question? I guess not |
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He probably means the vinyl releases. |
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'we' are just stupid when it comes to mp3/cd/vinly-discussion. noone actually heard the difference, not even the ones who would argue against simple physics that vinyl was better in terms of quality than cd or whatever with their oh so fine ears. we are deaf above 16khz so it does basically not matter - however: it shows a decline in production value and if they use a bad mp3 encoder then there is of course loss in quality. a serious label should not do that |
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the most interesting thing about this is that none of the "320kpbs mp3 OR NOTHING AT ALL" (apparently it's noticeable!) pedants picked up on it! ! |
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Seems this needs a bit of clarification... This 26 Mixes For Cash compilation is a collection of remixes that have appeared on other releases; ok, we all know this. Some appeared on vinyl only, some on CD, some on both; ok, we know this too. There is, for each of the original releases, master copies of the mixes sitting on some DAT/glass master/hard drive/etc somewhere in the depths of Warp HQ/Richards Mum's House/Point Music's Valuts/Heavenly Storage/whatever, and it seems to be pretty commonly held that some of these originals are "lost". When Warp decided to release this compilation rumour is that another label was about to do the same and various interested parties would rather Warp did it. So there was probably some small rush to collect & license all the original tracks from whoever held the copyright and sources for each. Big job, whether the rumour is true or not. If some originals are lost, then enquiries were probably made of people who stood a good chance of having the original CD version where the remix first appeared. Now, it would appear that whoever provided the source for these few lost mixes was less that honest about their ownership of the original, or maybe they really were downloaded as mp3. The above spectra show the differences between the remixes as they appear on their original CD pressings and as they appear on 26 Mixes. And they clearly show that some of the tracks have been compressed. There's is no good reason why Warp would have chosen to use compressed tracks or deliberately removed some of the audio from the original. None whatsoever. Persoally I wouldn't blame Warp for the (in my view) accidental slip. They seem like a bunch of decent guys n gals trying to do a good job in a thankless world. I guess the real reason for this thread is just so that folks know that this release is flawed and if they want the best quality, you still gotta find the original. It's still a great compilation though :) |
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Of course you can hear the difference. How do you think this was noticed in the first place? Nobody sits down and runs every audio track they come across through spectrum analysis. That would be wank. |
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mp3s sound so much warmer than the originals :) |
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If you are deaf above 16 KHz then you're missing out on a lot. Most people have this threshold above 20-22 KHz. Just for fun, compare a 16 KHz wav with a 22 KHz one and then tell me you cannot hear the difference. |
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yeah i know, 16khz is definitly to low. one day in the laboratory we tested ourselves up to 25khz (noone came above that). warp used really bad mp3s if you can hear the difference clearly. |
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this whole story does still have quite a funny side though :) |
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I´m not an audio engineer or even an expert in the audio field but even I can hear the difference between a 192 Kbit MP3 and a 320 Kbit MP3. The difference isnt huge (very small, in fact) bit its there. Having said that, I only have the original of the NIN remix and the seefeel remix and I cannot hear the difference personally (but maybe I should listen better). |
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it's fucking incredible how hearing improves when you play an instrument. continued concentration on sound makes your ears work better |
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ive downloaded a few drukqs albums in mp3 for comparisson and i now think idm sounds shit on mp3. but maybe it's winamp somehow: my own music, in wav, sounds totally different on it then burnt on cd |
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Hearing decreases from your birth. Many infants can hear about 20KHz, but it drops as you get older. I seriously doubt you can hear 25KHz....Seriously..... " we are deaf above 16khz so it does basically not matter -" "yeah i know, 16khz is definitly to low. one day in the laboratory we tested ourselves up to 25khz (noone came above that). " ??????????? |
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"it's fucking incredible how hearing improves when you play an instrument. continued concentration on sound makes your ears work better " This I can agree with, but I think it's just fine tuning your brain to look for more subtle changes in the notes....I also think listening to IDM can improve your hearing. Well, me personally at least. |
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i'd buy just about everything from afx no matter the quality.. |
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Most of the time, it's not like you can just play a song and right away tell if it's 192 or 320kbps rather than cd quality, but if you compare back to back, the cd and the mp3, you can definitely hear slight differences. I still prefer 192kbps set better than 320 VBR.. |
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Depends on the audio equipment too. But certainly......if you can't tellt he difference...well, : / :( |
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i hate mp3. i go out of my mind worrying im missing sound when listening to it. it's also the abundancy i guess, a lot i dled since i got broadband and next to none ive listened to |
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drukQs high quality/premium vinyl = instant meltdown. the quality is un-fucking-believable....i hate listening to my cds after hearing the vinyl |
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eh, does anyone remember that old aphex twin mp3 site that was in some eurpoean counrty? it used to be jam packed 24/7, so if you got on, you tended to download the entire site's contents... which was basically, as oif 1998-99, everything richard ever released / played on peel's shows. i downloaded all of those remixes, and i remember i made two aphex twin remixes cds.... and when 26 mixes for cash came out later, it was basically the same thing, minus the beck remix and whatever other ones arent on there. popcorn, for example... so basically since i've had all these tracks, albeit illegally, since 1998-99-etc, i never felt compelled to buy it, and evidently, i have even more reason not to. |
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I think the topic title has given a few people the wrong idea. All 26 tracks ARE NOT from mp3's, just the 3 i posted about are. And a point I'd like to make, is that if some Aphex slackers can find the original cd's/vinyl with the remixes I'm sure warp could. I have nothing against warp, but these track are definetaly mp3 sources. Nothing but mp3 would cut off all frequencies above 16Khz. And when you here the original Heroes remix there is a big difference to the one on 26 mixes. Aside fromt that nasty glitch not being there the channels are also reversed. And again, only the 3 mentioned tracks are mp3 sourced, the rest are fine. The topic titled just sounded catchy :) |
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